1
00:00:05,690 --> 00:00:03,260
warning if you like your UFO literature

2
00:00:08,059 --> 00:00:05,700
to confirm what you already know this is

3
00:00:09,709 --> 00:00:08,069
not the book for you from white crow

4
00:00:12,709 --> 00:00:09,719
books comes a brand-new collection of

5
00:00:14,900 --> 00:00:12,719
essays fourteen authors one goal to

6
00:00:17,810 --> 00:00:14,910
shatter the UFO topic and pick up the

7
00:00:19,820 --> 00:00:17,820
pieces in a whole new light compiled and

8
00:00:22,429 --> 00:00:19,830
edited by Robbie Graham with a foreword

9
00:00:25,310 --> 00:00:22,439
by Professor Diana Walsh kozelka UFOs

10
00:00:27,620 --> 00:00:25,320
reframing the debate is a cold hard slap

11
00:00:28,130 --> 00:00:27,630
in the face for ufology delivered with

12
00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:28,140
love

13
00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:31,170
UFOs reframing the debate available now

14
00:00:34,700 --> 00:00:32,489
in paperback and ebook

15
00:00:37,220 --> 00:00:34,710
on Amazon and at Barnes & Noble the Book

16
00:00:38,780 --> 00:00:37,230
Depository and the iBooks store for a

17
00:00:51,470 --> 00:00:38,790
complete list of contributors and to

18
00:00:54,510 --> 00:00:51,480
learn more visit Robbie Graham UK this

19
00:01:11,850 --> 00:00:54,520
is somewhere in the sky

20
00:01:14,140 --> 00:01:11,860
[Music]

21
00:01:17,170 --> 00:01:14,150
welcome to somewhere in the skies I'm

22
00:01:18,999 --> 00:01:17,180
your host Ryan sprung before we get to

23
00:01:21,100 --> 00:01:19,009
this week's conversation I want to take

24
00:01:22,960 --> 00:01:21,110
just a moment to send my condolences to

25
00:01:26,139 --> 00:01:22,970
the friends and family of Jim martyrs

26
00:01:27,999 --> 00:01:26,149
who passed away on August 2nd for those

27
00:01:29,830 --> 00:01:28,009
who don't know Jim was a journalist and

28
00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:29,840
a New York Times bestselling author of

29
00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:32,090
numerous books and articles pertaining

30
00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:34,610
to cover-ups and conspiracies his

31
00:01:38,710 --> 00:01:35,930
best-known book would have to be

32
00:01:41,770 --> 00:01:38,720
crossfire which was a main source for

33
00:01:43,719 --> 00:01:41,780
the Oliver Stone film JFK for over 30

34
00:01:46,359 --> 00:01:43,729
years Jim also taught a course at the

35
00:01:48,490 --> 00:01:46,369
University of Texas at Arlington on the

36
00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:48,500
JFK assassination he wrote many other

37
00:01:54,430 --> 00:01:50,330
books on many other topics such as

38
00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:54,440
secret societies 9/11 UFO cover-ups and

39
00:01:58,690 --> 00:01:56,810
everything in between so when I was

40
00:02:00,580 --> 00:01:58,700
first starting out in the UFO field I

41
00:02:03,430 --> 00:02:00,590
didn't know where to turn or who to talk

42
00:02:06,370 --> 00:02:03,440
to you it was a mess but then Jim's book

43
00:02:09,130 --> 00:02:06,380
alien agenda came out and I happened to

44
00:02:11,110 --> 00:02:09,140
buy it at the local Wegmans grocery

45
00:02:13,420 --> 00:02:11,120
store I reached out to Jim after reading

46
00:02:16,599 --> 00:02:13,430
the book as a complete little buddy and

47
00:02:18,580 --> 00:02:16,609
he actually wrote me back then I had the

48
00:02:20,229 --> 00:02:18,590
immense pleasure of interviewing him for

49
00:02:22,030 --> 00:02:20,239
an article I was writing at the time and

50
00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:22,040
he couldn't have been more giving and

51
00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:24,410
professional his work has been

52
00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:26,450
translated into many different languages

53
00:02:31,380 --> 00:02:29,090
and his books lined the shelves of every

54
00:02:34,479 --> 00:02:31,390
bookstore and library across the globe

55
00:02:37,210 --> 00:02:34,489
we may have lost Jim but his work and

56
00:02:39,910 --> 00:02:37,220
legacy will always live on rest in peace

57
00:02:41,470 --> 00:02:39,920
my friend now I don't like her note for

58
00:02:43,870 --> 00:02:41,480
those who don't know today's guest he is

59
00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:43,880
not only a colleague of mine but my

60
00:02:49,539 --> 00:02:45,890
mentor and for those who don't know me

61
00:02:52,180 --> 00:02:49,549
my other passions beyond UFOs is fever I

62
00:02:53,770 --> 00:02:52,190
work and Broadway here in New York City

63
00:02:55,930 --> 00:02:53,780
to pay the bill with and when I'm not

64
00:02:58,930 --> 00:02:55,940
writing or talking about UFOs I am

65
00:03:00,970 --> 00:02:58,940
writing plays and movies today's guest

66
00:03:02,559 --> 00:03:00,980
has walked a similar path having worked

67
00:03:04,420 --> 00:03:02,569
with some of the most prominent theatre

68
00:03:06,789 --> 00:03:04,430
companies here in New York City he is

69
00:03:09,039 --> 00:03:06,799
also an artist and one hell of an

70
00:03:11,530 --> 00:03:09,049
investigative writer I am talking about

71
00:03:13,300 --> 00:03:11,540
Peter Robin now Peter and I made up at

72
00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:13,310
least once a month at our favorite diner

73
00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:15,290
in midtown Manhattan and talked for

74
00:03:18,270 --> 00:03:17,690
hours and hours about everything under

75
00:03:20,850 --> 00:03:18,280
the Sun

76
00:03:22,890 --> 00:03:20,860
but this time Peter came to my home turf

77
00:03:25,500 --> 00:03:22,900
and queens and we took back a few beers

78
00:03:27,420 --> 00:03:25,510
made our way to the recording studio and

79
00:03:29,790 --> 00:03:27,430
sat down for this conversation in about

80
00:03:31,590 --> 00:03:29,800
two years now I have to warn you this

81
00:03:33,420 --> 00:03:31,600
conversation centers around a new

82
00:03:35,610 --> 00:03:33,430
lecture peter is presenting around the

83
00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:35,620
world right now and it relies heavy on

84
00:03:39,780 --> 00:03:37,930
images so I decided to post all of those

85
00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:39,790
images on the website version of this

86
00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:42,610
episode it will benefit you greatly -

87
00:03:46,860 --> 00:03:44,410
listen this way just go to somewhere in

88
00:03:50,340 --> 00:03:46,870
the skies calm click on the podcast tab

89
00:03:53,190 --> 00:03:50,350
then go to episodes 17 with people and

90
00:03:55,020 --> 00:03:53,200
stream the episode there this is just a

91
00:03:57,150 --> 00:03:55,030
suggestion if you're listening to this

92
00:04:00,390 --> 00:03:57,160
on iTunes stitcher Google Play or

93
00:04:02,729 --> 00:04:00,400
YouTube it may be a little different but

94
00:04:04,979 --> 00:04:02,739
you won't lose them alright enough

95
00:04:07,410 --> 00:04:04,989
preamble this week let's sit down with

96
00:04:09,570 --> 00:04:07,420
the one and only peter robbins peter

97
00:04:11,430 --> 00:04:09,580
thanks for joining me today a pleasure

98
00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:11,440
and great being out here in queens my

99
00:04:17,460 --> 00:04:14,170
birthplace yes yes a lot of people don't

100
00:04:19,319 --> 00:04:17,470
know we are one of few researchers out

101
00:04:21,270 --> 00:04:19,329
here on the east coast so whenever we

102
00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:21,280
get the opportunity to meet up we always

103
00:04:25,409 --> 00:04:22,570
make that happen

104
00:04:28,350 --> 00:04:25,419
we just came from a wonderful tide

105
00:04:30,300 --> 00:04:28,360
dinner some drinks and we're really

106
00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:30,310
going to run the gamut today so I'm very

107
00:04:34,500 --> 00:04:32,410
excited one of the things you and I have

108
00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:34,510
in common that many of the listeners

109
00:04:39,450 --> 00:04:37,210
might not know is our love for theater

110
00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:39,460
yeah we both grew up with very extensive

111
00:04:43,710 --> 00:04:41,650
theater backgrounds and we started

112
00:04:45,840 --> 00:04:43,720
getting into a story a dinner that I

113
00:04:47,610 --> 00:04:45,850
thought would be perfect to start this

114
00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:47,620
conversation with I agreed something

115
00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:49,210
different from the usual you Falah

116
00:04:53,370 --> 00:04:51,490
djegal talk so I want to start with that

117
00:04:56,130 --> 00:04:53,380
tonight if you could tell us about this

118
00:04:58,710 --> 00:04:56,140
did this experience you had with some

119
00:05:01,200 --> 00:04:58,720
well-known people in the UFO field well

120
00:05:03,659 --> 00:05:01,210
it's more than that we love theater we

121
00:05:06,510 --> 00:05:03,669
both worked in it professionally you're

122
00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:06,520
a trained actor and a playwright I am a

123
00:05:12,450 --> 00:05:09,010
trained actor but I don't act I still

124
00:05:14,460 --> 00:05:12,460
awed it my dear friend John Strasbourg's

125
00:05:18,540 --> 00:05:14,470
acting classes when I'm able in New York

126
00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:18,550
and attended to this weekend I find it

127
00:05:25,140 --> 00:05:22,050
inspiring to watch as these

128
00:05:27,719 --> 00:05:25,150
extraordinary artists trained to make us

129
00:05:30,340 --> 00:05:27,729
feel the things we feel in live stage in

130
00:05:33,970 --> 00:05:30,350
the theater on screen

131
00:05:37,020 --> 00:05:33,980
television good work and for years I

132
00:05:40,710 --> 00:05:37,030
worked in theater management managing

133
00:05:42,790 --> 00:05:40,720
the theater for one of the premier

134
00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:42,800
repertory companies in the history of

135
00:05:48,090 --> 00:05:45,770
New York City got to work with Academy

136
00:05:52,030 --> 00:05:48,100
Award and Tony award-winning actors and

137
00:05:54,340 --> 00:05:52,040
dozens and dozens of some of the finest

138
00:05:56,830 --> 00:05:54,350
actors in America many of whom we all

139
00:05:58,150 --> 00:05:56,840
grew up moving their faces but if your

140
00:05:59,860 --> 00:05:58,160
life depended on it you didn't know

141
00:06:01,720 --> 00:05:59,870
their name yes you've seen them in so

142
00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:01,730
many television episodes in small parts

143
00:06:06,910 --> 00:06:05,330
and films and over the course of the

144
00:06:09,310 --> 00:06:06,920
many years that I worked as but Hopkins

145
00:06:10,990 --> 00:06:09,320
assistant for a good number of those

146
00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:11,000
years I was in theater management as

147
00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:14,570
well but who like most New Yorkers loved

148
00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:17,690
theater many other people that are New

149
00:06:24,310 --> 00:06:21,410
Yorkers as well um I'd always make sure

150
00:06:26,050 --> 00:06:24,320
that he attended a preview usually with

151
00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:26,060
a guest or once a play was up and

152
00:06:34,300 --> 00:06:30,050
running and bud from 1989 until he

153
00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:34,310
passed in 2011 we had a non-profit

154
00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:35,810
foundation called the intruders

155
00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:38,450
Foundation right which had a kind of a

156
00:06:46,690 --> 00:06:42,770
double pronged mandate of being mayor

157
00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:46,700
for people who were UFO abductees had

158
00:06:53,230 --> 00:06:49,610
were experiencers had had these

159
00:06:57,340 --> 00:06:53,240
experiences to support them to assist

160
00:07:00,340 --> 00:06:57,350
them we ran support groups but of course

161
00:07:03,670 --> 00:07:00,350
conducted hypnotic regressions at these

162
00:07:07,870 --> 00:07:03,680
individuals requests and I kept the

163
00:07:11,110 --> 00:07:07,880
records but we also as part of the

164
00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:11,120
intruders foundation we felt we had a

165
00:07:17,350 --> 00:07:14,690
mandate to educate folks we had various

166
00:07:20,740 --> 00:07:17,360
conferences we had a regular publication

167
00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:20,750
and usually for about two-thirds of

168
00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:22,610
every year sometimes three-quarters of

169
00:07:28,330 --> 00:07:24,890
every year every six weeks or so we

170
00:07:30,940 --> 00:07:28,340
would bring a speaker to New York or

171
00:07:34,910 --> 00:07:30,950
sometimes from well out of town other

172
00:07:38,540 --> 00:07:34,920
times from you know the general area and

173
00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:38,550
was at the AR evn Dirk AC center they

174
00:07:46,490 --> 00:07:43,050
have aloft in the West 30s and on on

175
00:07:48,860 --> 00:07:46,500
this one particular time the person who

176
00:07:50,980 --> 00:07:48,870
was going to be speaking was dr. Roger

177
00:07:54,050 --> 00:07:50,990
Leir for many of your listeners

178
00:07:56,030 --> 00:07:54,060
certainly the ones who are you know

179
00:07:58,160 --> 00:07:56,040
serious students of the UFO subject

180
00:08:01,010 --> 00:07:58,170
Rogers name is probably not unknown to

181
00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:01,020
them for anybody that is not familiar

182
00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:04,170
with it Roger was a podiatric surgeon

183
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:06,810
who became very involved in UFO studies

184
00:08:14,350 --> 00:08:10,610
focused on one of the most enigmatic

185
00:08:17,780 --> 00:08:14,360
fascinating disturbing extremely

186
00:08:20,510 --> 00:08:17,790
attention-grabbing aspects of the

187
00:08:24,350 --> 00:08:20,520
abduction phenomena namely implants

188
00:08:27,170 --> 00:08:24,360
these foreign bodies that are put into

189
00:08:30,740 --> 00:08:27,180
our bodies now make no mistake about it

190
00:08:32,990 --> 00:08:30,750
we human beings have now long had this

191
00:08:35,210 --> 00:08:33,000
technology and use it I've been

192
00:08:38,270 --> 00:08:35,220
following the story in human terms from

193
00:08:41,420 --> 00:08:38,280
to over 25 years and the first time I

194
00:08:44,390 --> 00:08:41,430
heard a reference to implants in human

195
00:08:46,550 --> 00:08:44,400
terms beyond the ones that we were

196
00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:46,560
studying learning about seeing showing

197
00:08:54,230 --> 00:08:49,110
up in x-rays and cat scans of people

198
00:08:57,850 --> 00:08:54,240
with UFO related histories was again

199
00:09:00,590 --> 00:08:57,860
about 25 years ago or so when in a

200
00:09:04,490 --> 00:09:00,600
agricultural publication an ad was

201
00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:04,500
forwarded to me for a thing about the

202
00:09:09,940 --> 00:09:05,850
size of a quarter

203
00:09:13,130 --> 00:09:09,950
an American quarter it was a small

204
00:09:17,270 --> 00:09:13,140
relatively small electronic device that

205
00:09:22,690 --> 00:09:17,280
simply gave out a signal and it was made

206
00:09:28,460 --> 00:09:22,700
specifically to be placed subcutaneously

207
00:09:31,640 --> 00:09:28,470
into a slit made in a cow's ear with a

208
00:09:33,650 --> 00:09:31,650
local anesthetic and the idea was if

209
00:09:36,710 --> 00:09:33,660
you're one of your cows in your herd

210
00:09:39,830 --> 00:09:36,720
wandered off you had a simple receiver

211
00:09:41,990 --> 00:09:39,840
where you could actually not just trace

212
00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:42,000
the cow but you could see that it was a

213
00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:43,890
neighbor's pasture you know it had a

214
00:09:48,980 --> 00:09:46,650
limited range mile or whatever found it

215
00:09:52,070 --> 00:09:48,990
fascinating not surprisingly over

216
00:09:55,100 --> 00:09:52,080
decades the technology has miniaturized

217
00:09:57,050 --> 00:09:55,110
and now they're not much bigger in some

218
00:09:59,600 --> 00:09:57,060
cases they're about the same size as the

219
00:10:02,269 --> 00:09:59,610
ones that are truly anomalous they are

220
00:10:05,540 --> 00:10:02,279
usually more or less about the shape of

221
00:10:08,030 --> 00:10:05,550
a grain of rice or BB they are silicon

222
00:10:10,010 --> 00:10:08,040
based or metallic based and this little

223
00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:10,020
digression is necessary for this

224
00:10:17,420 --> 00:10:13,730
charming little story first dr. Leir as

225
00:10:19,820 --> 00:10:17,430
somebody who was a foot surgeon and a

226
00:10:21,829 --> 00:10:19,830
student of the UFO subject began to

227
00:10:25,220 --> 00:10:21,839
network with people like Hopkins and

228
00:10:27,820 --> 00:10:25,230
ultimately John Mac other leading

229
00:10:31,310 --> 00:10:27,830
figures in abduction research and

230
00:10:33,699 --> 00:10:31,320
ultimately began to agree and I'm sure

231
00:10:36,500 --> 00:10:33,709
with a fair amount of care and concern

232
00:10:38,780 --> 00:10:36,510
relative to his professional reputation

233
00:10:41,540 --> 00:10:38,790
any possibility of legal blowback or

234
00:10:45,380 --> 00:10:41,550
something to remove and examine these

235
00:10:47,630 --> 00:10:45,390
things where possible I had seen a

236
00:10:50,449 --> 00:10:47,640
number of them not that he removed nuts

237
00:10:52,250 --> 00:10:50,459
and I find them very enigmatic we know

238
00:10:54,769 --> 00:10:52,260
there's only a limited amount of

239
00:10:58,340 --> 00:10:54,779
possibilities of either their monitoring

240
00:11:00,650 --> 00:10:58,350
control perhaps even assistance possibly

241
00:11:02,840 --> 00:11:00,660
darker scenarios anyway to cut to the

242
00:11:06,110 --> 00:11:02,850
chase dr. Lear was going to be our

243
00:11:09,019 --> 00:11:06,120
speaker for a particular event I think

244
00:11:11,329 --> 00:11:09,029
they were I was a Saturday night and on

245
00:11:13,430 --> 00:11:11,339
the Sunday we did matinees on the

246
00:11:15,560 --> 00:11:13,440
weekends on a Wednesday I don't remember

247
00:11:17,930 --> 00:11:15,570
whether it was a matinee or the evening

248
00:11:21,069 --> 00:11:17,940
but I had gotten tickets for the play

249
00:11:24,530 --> 00:11:21,079
which was a comedy for bud and for Roger

250
00:11:26,569 --> 00:11:24,540
again dr. Lear was a very outgoing guy

251
00:11:30,860 --> 00:11:26,579
and he speak to anybody that knew him as

252
00:11:32,540 --> 00:11:30,870
I say about him and bud and dr. Mac they

253
00:11:34,310 --> 00:11:32,550
were not only great men they were great

254
00:11:36,860 --> 00:11:34,320
guys they were a lot of fun they were

255
00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:36,870
very involved in living life to the

256
00:11:42,230 --> 00:11:39,450
fullest as well as doing important

257
00:11:45,680 --> 00:11:42,240
serious sometimes nerve-wracking work

258
00:11:48,710 --> 00:11:45,690
and essentially the main thing I

259
00:11:50,750 --> 00:11:48,720
remember was they came to the play I

260
00:11:52,730 --> 00:11:50,760
invited them backstage they got to meet

261
00:11:55,310 --> 00:11:52,740
some of the actors again whether or not

262
00:11:58,160 --> 00:11:55,320
it was a matinee or an evening

263
00:12:02,210 --> 00:11:58,170
performance we went out had a drink or

264
00:12:04,550 --> 00:12:02,220
two and just for me pulling back and one

265
00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:04,560
those moments where you remember these

266
00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:06,720
people would have never met in a

267
00:12:10,550 --> 00:12:08,130
thousand years if it weren't for this

268
00:12:14,090 --> 00:12:10,560
quirky little connection here but what

269
00:12:16,310 --> 00:12:14,100
fun they both had and what fun my

270
00:12:19,370 --> 00:12:16,320
colleagues my friends in the theater had

271
00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:19,380
with these two extremely brilliant very

272
00:12:24,290 --> 00:12:22,170
funny guys who what they knew from my

273
00:12:27,050 --> 00:12:24,300
brief introduction was that they were

274
00:12:29,420 --> 00:12:27,060
involved in UFO studies like I was but I

275
00:12:33,560 --> 00:12:29,430
thought you know why even bother to tell

276
00:12:35,030 --> 00:12:33,570
them all of the nomenclature I will add

277
00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:35,040
one thing and it's something we were

278
00:12:37,810 --> 00:12:37,410
talking about as we were heading toward

279
00:12:40,610 --> 00:12:37,820
dinner

280
00:12:43,220 --> 00:12:40,620
it was dr. Leir who established

281
00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:43,230
something that we didn't know about the

282
00:12:47,420 --> 00:12:45,330
implants although deductive reasoning

283
00:12:50,990 --> 00:12:47,430
suggested that this would have been

284
00:12:53,210 --> 00:12:51,000
logical you don't have to be a medical

285
00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:53,220
person to know that if you get a

286
00:12:59,450 --> 00:12:56,250
splinter or some foreign body large

287
00:13:01,970 --> 00:12:59,460
lodged in your body be it a biological

288
00:13:04,430 --> 00:13:01,980
entity or you know some little thing

289
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:04,440
that doesn't belong there the white

290
00:13:09,980 --> 00:13:06,810
blood cells will essentially you know

291
00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:09,990
declare a riot and head for the site we

292
00:13:15,500 --> 00:13:13,170
can see it it we've all had times would

293
00:13:18,170 --> 00:13:15,510
have had a infection on the surface of

294
00:13:20,990 --> 00:13:18,180
her body again a sponge is a classic

295
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:21,000
thing everything gets red white there

296
00:13:25,370 --> 00:13:23,730
may be pulsation there may be pain once

297
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:25,380
it's removed and cleaned everything goes

298
00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:28,530
away so how is it that this history of

299
00:13:36,830 --> 00:13:34,290
these non-human seemingly little things

300
00:13:41,210 --> 00:13:36,840
these we assume er technological devices

301
00:13:43,130 --> 00:13:41,220
inserted under the skin that they the

302
00:13:46,310 --> 00:13:43,140
body doesn't seem to recognize them

303
00:13:49,460 --> 00:13:46,320
what's that about and what dr. Lear

304
00:13:52,490 --> 00:13:49,470
established and it was it certainly

305
00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:52,500
didn't make the major media but it

306
00:13:57,560 --> 00:13:55,170
certainly raised eyebrows and answered

307
00:14:00,680 --> 00:13:57,570
some questions in our immediate circle

308
00:14:03,020 --> 00:14:00,690
of scholarship and research that he was

309
00:14:05,810 --> 00:14:03,030
working with one that was elongated like

310
00:14:11,060 --> 00:14:05,820
a piece of rice and it had what amounted

311
00:14:14,510 --> 00:14:11,070
to a hyper thin skin on it that he could

312
00:14:16,010 --> 00:14:14,520
not dislodge with an absolutely new

313
00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:16,020
surgical scalpel

314
00:14:23,540 --> 00:14:20,450
and this skin under careful cover

315
00:14:27,170 --> 00:14:23,550
observation magnification whether it was

316
00:14:29,269 --> 00:14:27,180
biological or chemical I don't remember

317
00:14:31,550 --> 00:14:29,279
I don't think a sample could be removed

318
00:14:34,870 --> 00:14:31,560
for analysis and I don't know how it

319
00:14:40,460 --> 00:14:34,880
resolved is a bunch of years ago but

320
00:14:45,220 --> 00:14:40,470
what it did like the dead black kind of

321
00:14:49,340 --> 00:14:45,230
paint that they use on our RB ones and

322
00:14:52,570 --> 00:14:49,350
spy planes it created it kind of a

323
00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:52,580
stealth situation where the body simply

324
00:14:57,680 --> 00:14:55,770
doesn't recognize that there is this

325
00:15:00,079 --> 00:14:57,690
intruder that there is this thing that

326
00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:00,089
doesn't belong there again we're off on

327
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:02,370
a tangent here and a mixed memory of a

328
00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:05,610
very wonderful funny night of being in

329
00:15:10,130 --> 00:15:07,890
the theatre which I love having the

330
00:15:13,970 --> 00:15:10,140
pride of sharing it with two very

331
00:15:16,639 --> 00:15:13,980
distinguished people in my life and you

332
00:15:19,550 --> 00:15:16,649
know ultimately that it comes down to a

333
00:15:21,470 --> 00:15:19,560
very early connection with us this

334
00:15:23,750 --> 00:15:21,480
obsession this passion with the subject

335
00:15:26,810 --> 00:15:23,760
of UFOs and their implications for

336
00:15:29,990 --> 00:15:26,820
Humanity and a love of the performing

337
00:15:32,660 --> 00:15:30,000
arts yeah and there's many stories to be

338
00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:32,670
had in both those facets and I think

339
00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:33,810
that's what I think that's what

340
00:15:38,150 --> 00:15:36,570
attracted me to your work I knew from

341
00:15:41,420 --> 00:15:38,160
the first time I heard you speak I could

342
00:15:43,100 --> 00:15:41,430
tell this guy he is he knows what he's

343
00:15:45,079 --> 00:15:43,110
doing he's not only a good public

344
00:15:49,069 --> 00:15:45,089
speaker he knows how to tell a story and

345
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:49,079
we see that mirrored in many of these

346
00:15:55,940 --> 00:15:51,930
UFO events as well while they may not

347
00:15:59,210 --> 00:15:55,950
happen as linear as the experiencer

348
00:16:01,940 --> 00:15:59,220
would hope yeah there is that whole idea

349
00:16:04,490 --> 00:16:01,950
that the human is what matters most we

350
00:16:08,449 --> 00:16:04,500
can always we can always look at this as

351
00:16:11,269 --> 00:16:08,459
a very alien topic or find the UFO

352
00:16:12,860 --> 00:16:11,279
sighting tantalizing or exciting but

353
00:16:15,740 --> 00:16:12,870
when it comes down to it's the person

354
00:16:17,990 --> 00:16:15,750
having the experience and I think

355
00:16:20,569 --> 00:16:18,000
someone like you who I've learned from

356
00:16:22,639 --> 00:16:20,579
is to have compassion for these people

357
00:16:24,740 --> 00:16:22,649
for someone who has one of those

358
00:16:27,110 --> 00:16:24,750
implants I can't even imagine going day

359
00:16:28,910 --> 00:16:27,120
to day thinking I want to I want to rip

360
00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:28,920
this thing out of my body or what if I

361
00:16:32,569 --> 00:16:29,730
do what if

362
00:16:34,610 --> 00:16:32,579
it completely uh you know there for a

363
00:16:36,650 --> 00:16:34,620
reason that it's there for a we should

364
00:16:39,050 --> 00:16:36,660
be yep and like you said either

365
00:16:42,769 --> 00:16:39,060
monitoring or if it's taken out will let

366
00:16:45,500 --> 00:16:42,779
it affect them it's scary it's scary to

367
00:16:46,610 --> 00:16:45,510
even think about it it is especially not

368
00:16:50,269 --> 00:16:46,620
knowing where it came from

369
00:16:52,460 --> 00:16:50,279
yeah and as I've said to you one way or

370
00:16:54,860 --> 00:16:52,470
the other over the years even after

371
00:16:56,780 --> 00:16:54,870
decades of work in this field we have

372
00:17:00,110 --> 00:16:56,790
colleagues a number of them whom I

373
00:17:02,509 --> 00:17:00,120
consider real friends and they are

374
00:17:04,220 --> 00:17:02,519
considered authorities in their area of

375
00:17:07,069 --> 00:17:04,230
study and they've certainly earned the

376
00:17:12,380 --> 00:17:07,079
right I I still wince when I hear

377
00:17:15,470 --> 00:17:12,390
somebody referred to as a UFO expert it

378
00:17:18,579 --> 00:17:15,480
seems like kind of an existential

379
00:17:21,980 --> 00:17:18,589
oxymoron we're talking about the

380
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:21,990
absolutely bloody absolute unknown and

381
00:17:27,590 --> 00:17:26,250
to be an expert in the unknown is I

382
00:17:31,340 --> 00:17:27,600
don't even know how to complete the

383
00:17:33,380 --> 00:17:31,350
sentence um as it discuss a little bit

384
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:33,390
later for me one of the guiding

385
00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:35,850
principles among people that do the work

386
00:17:41,299 --> 00:17:38,850
among people that follow the work among

387
00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:41,309
people that make fun of the work among

388
00:17:45,970 --> 00:17:43,410
people who can care less about it but

389
00:17:49,190 --> 00:17:45,980
love the whole hyperbole and hype and

390
00:17:52,310 --> 00:17:49,200
drama as captured in science fiction

391
00:17:55,490 --> 00:17:52,320
good and bad the wording of the iconic

392
00:17:58,460 --> 00:17:55,500
poster that helped define one of the

393
00:18:00,560 --> 00:17:58,470
most popular television shows in modern

394
00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:00,570
history and certainly one of the most

395
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:04,890
successful when it come to looking at

396
00:18:10,190 --> 00:18:08,490
the paranormal and UFO research kicked

397
00:18:11,930 --> 00:18:10,200
in in the early 90s and I'm sure

398
00:18:14,330 --> 00:18:11,940
everybody has seen episodes of it or

399
00:18:18,169 --> 00:18:14,340
seen them all which is the x-files and

400
00:18:20,990 --> 00:18:18,179
in the very first episode which either

401
00:18:24,289 --> 00:18:21,000
as a fan of the show as a serious

402
00:18:28,730 --> 00:18:24,299
student of UFOs wanting to see how a

403
00:18:31,190 --> 00:18:28,740
fictional show hit the ground running to

404
00:18:35,750 --> 00:18:31,200
deal with the subject of UFOs in the

405
00:18:38,060 --> 00:18:35,760
unknown very well or as somebody whose

406
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:38,070
life revolves around theater film

407
00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:42,690
creative arts that first episode is

408
00:18:48,830 --> 00:18:45,810
as good a pilot as you will ever see for

409
00:18:50,690 --> 00:18:48,840
any show Chris Carter and his writers

410
00:18:53,270 --> 00:18:50,700
were no slouches and they hit the ground

411
00:18:56,210 --> 00:18:53,280
running my point being that in the first

412
00:19:00,260 --> 00:18:56,220
episode among other things we meet not

413
00:19:02,780 --> 00:19:00,270
an individual but an iconic poster that

414
00:19:05,210 --> 00:19:02,790
is up on the wall of Fox Mulder's office

415
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:05,220
in the basement and the writers could

416
00:19:10,210 --> 00:19:07,050
have created any text they wanted and

417
00:19:15,530 --> 00:19:10,220
what did they use I want to believe and

418
00:19:17,450 --> 00:19:15,540
doesn't that define so much about all of

419
00:19:19,580 --> 00:19:17,460
us that are in the work one way or the

420
00:19:23,270 --> 00:19:19,590
other even if what you want to believe

421
00:19:27,890 --> 00:19:23,280
is that this is all nonsense and you

422
00:19:30,650 --> 00:19:27,900
wish it would go away or or or yeah it's

423
00:19:32,660 --> 00:19:30,660
such a wonderful way to look at it

424
00:19:36,020 --> 00:19:32,670
there's such a delineation between want

425
00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:36,030
to believe and to believe which we'll

426
00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:38,610
definitely touch on well in terms of the

427
00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:43,770
x-files such a pop culture boom it

428
00:19:48,710 --> 00:19:46,890
changed television in my opinion we're

429
00:19:51,380 --> 00:19:48,720
giving 10 new episodes from what I've

430
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:51,390
learned this week yeah with our original

431
00:19:57,700 --> 00:19:53,850
stars again that nothing could excites

432
00:20:00,500 --> 00:19:57,710
me more that this mythos of

433
00:20:02,810 --> 00:20:00,510
investigating the unknown and the UFO

434
00:20:05,150 --> 00:20:02,820
topic continues to live on in the

435
00:20:07,580 --> 00:20:05,160
mainstream yes in pop culture real

436
00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:07,590
investigation a real investigation in

437
00:20:11,990 --> 00:20:10,170
terms of pop culture I know you the

438
00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:12,000
reason you're here in New York this time

439
00:20:18,230 --> 00:20:14,730
is you gave well we're going to give two

440
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:18,240
talks because of the attentiveness of

441
00:20:21,950 --> 00:20:19,770
your audience you are only able to give

442
00:20:25,190 --> 00:20:21,960
one which is astounding because of the

443
00:20:28,850 --> 00:20:25,200
reason one of them touched on the idea

444
00:20:31,610 --> 00:20:28,860
of UFOs in pop culture and how its

445
00:20:33,710 --> 00:20:31,620
influenced culture in general if you

446
00:20:35,210 --> 00:20:33,720
sort of touch on that for a while you

447
00:20:39,830 --> 00:20:35,220
spoke about do more than that

448
00:20:43,220 --> 00:20:39,840
cool um the very quick back story was I

449
00:20:46,250 --> 00:20:43,230
had spoken earlier this month at the New

450
00:20:49,250 --> 00:20:46,260
Life Expo which is some of your

451
00:20:51,410 --> 00:20:49,260
listeners know is a very big franchise

452
00:20:54,860 --> 00:20:51,420
kind of conference they happen in Los

453
00:20:55,869 --> 00:20:54,870
Angeles New York Palm Beach and it's

454
00:20:58,359 --> 00:20:55,879
like a template

455
00:21:02,349 --> 00:20:58,369
they bring in a lot of great presenters

456
00:21:05,199 --> 00:21:02,359
in UFOs are the least of it paranormal

457
00:21:08,349 --> 00:21:05,209
studies alternate healing mystical

458
00:21:12,219 --> 00:21:08,359
topics radical nutrition mysteries in

459
00:21:15,969 --> 00:21:12,229
history all of that stuff and being part

460
00:21:20,349 --> 00:21:15,979
of the one in New York City I found

461
00:21:23,889 --> 00:21:20,359
really fascinating and doubly enjoyable

462
00:21:26,319 --> 00:21:23,899
because being that it's in Manhattan the

463
00:21:29,169 --> 00:21:26,329
audience visually is not like your

464
00:21:32,729 --> 00:21:29,179
average generic UFO conference audience

465
00:21:38,979 --> 00:21:32,739
you have everybody in the planet there

466
00:21:41,799 --> 00:21:38,989
every race every look possible very

467
00:21:44,139 --> 00:21:41,809
young people very old people every

468
00:21:47,109 --> 00:21:44,149
manner of dress from Street clothing to

469
00:21:48,819 --> 00:21:47,119
the beyond outrageous and thousands of

470
00:21:51,189 --> 00:21:48,829
people thousands of people coming and

471
00:21:54,849 --> 00:21:51,199
going over the four days or so that it

472
00:21:59,349 --> 00:21:54,859
ran anyway I connected or reconnected

473
00:22:02,019 --> 00:21:59,359
there with a gentleman who in my life as

474
00:22:05,049 --> 00:22:02,029
an investigative writer and a public

475
00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:05,059
presence I have a number of real friends

476
00:22:11,499 --> 00:22:08,690
who began as readers or who heard me

477
00:22:14,289 --> 00:22:11,509
speak on a radio show like this or at a

478
00:22:16,839 --> 00:22:14,299
conference or you know saw me in a

479
00:22:19,180 --> 00:22:16,849
documentary what have you either sent me

480
00:22:22,859 --> 00:22:19,190
an email or made contact with me on

481
00:22:25,509 --> 00:22:22,869
Facebook we became Facebook friends and

482
00:22:28,869 --> 00:22:25,519
sometimes these things mutate into

483
00:22:32,769 --> 00:22:28,879
genuine real friendships and with my

484
00:22:36,969 --> 00:22:32,779
friend William here we had met in 2013

485
00:22:40,029 --> 00:22:36,979
in Washington DC when I had the honor of

486
00:22:42,969 --> 00:22:40,039
being one of the witnesses who gave

487
00:22:45,789 --> 00:22:42,979
testimony before the Congressional

488
00:22:48,009 --> 00:22:45,799
Committee of retired congressional

489
00:22:50,079 --> 00:22:48,019
representatives and one senator that the

490
00:22:51,909 --> 00:22:50,089
great Steve Bassett had created as a

491
00:22:57,009 --> 00:22:51,919
disclosure event at the National Press

492
00:22:59,979 --> 00:22:57,019
Club and William came to my talk my two

493
00:23:03,219 --> 00:22:59,989
talks and my discussion panel I was on

494
00:23:05,769 --> 00:23:03,229
in New York early this month one thing

495
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:05,779
led to another and he said that he had a

496
00:23:09,530 --> 00:23:07,290
large apartment in New York

497
00:23:12,350 --> 00:23:09,540
as a professional musician he had used

498
00:23:15,010 --> 00:23:12,360
it for you know small concerts and

499
00:23:18,170 --> 00:23:15,020
things in kind of a salon atmosphere and

500
00:23:21,650 --> 00:23:18,180
I like that tremendously the idea that

501
00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:21,660
30 or 40 people could come together in a

502
00:23:25,820 --> 00:23:24,330
very informal atmosphere in a home that

503
00:23:27,710 --> 00:23:25,830
was large enough to accommodate them

504
00:23:31,370 --> 00:23:27,720
where the owner had that many folding

505
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:31,380
chairs and a nice white wall and so our

506
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:34,290
plan was for this past Saturday that we

507
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:38,450
would both invites and I would give a

508
00:23:46,010 --> 00:23:43,410
version of a talk that I'm on a subject

509
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:46,020
that has fascinated me for decades that

510
00:23:51,980 --> 00:23:47,850
I've been developing on and off for

511
00:23:56,930 --> 00:23:51,990
years and that this summer in early July

512
00:23:59,810 --> 00:23:56,940
I will give a version of a talk at the

513
00:24:02,330 --> 00:23:59,820
big conference in wazzle New Mexico in

514
00:24:06,650 --> 00:24:02,340
fact this summer is the 70th anniversary

515
00:24:09,110 --> 00:24:06,660
of the Roswell crash so it will be a big

516
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:09,120
special conference and the talk that I'm

517
00:24:14,330 --> 00:24:11,970
giving revolves around a subject that I

518
00:24:18,410 --> 00:24:14,340
can almost guarantee has crossed the

519
00:24:21,500 --> 00:24:18,420
mind of anyone who was seriously gone

520
00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:21,510
through that first door of gosh maybe

521
00:24:25,460 --> 00:24:23,130
there is something to this whole UFO

522
00:24:27,500 --> 00:24:25,470
phenomena and maybe some of them are

523
00:24:30,110 --> 00:24:27,510
from other places and why are they here

524
00:24:33,050 --> 00:24:30,120
and what's it all about I call the talk

525
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:33,060
more or less the origins of the UFO

526
00:24:38,990 --> 00:24:35,970
ridicule factor and the more I thought

527
00:24:41,690 --> 00:24:39,000
about it and began to develop it into a

528
00:24:43,220 --> 00:24:41,700
format kind of a modular format that

529
00:24:46,250 --> 00:24:43,230
could be longer or shorter as a

530
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:46,260
presentation depending on what the

531
00:24:53,270 --> 00:24:49,890
sponsor wanted and was it's so counter

532
00:24:55,430 --> 00:24:53,280
intuitive when you look at the reality

533
00:24:57,800 --> 00:24:55,440
the best example I can give is let's

534
00:25:00,470 --> 00:24:57,810
just say you and I are the friends we

535
00:25:02,150 --> 00:25:00,480
are through the theater but we live in a

536
00:25:04,370 --> 00:25:02,160
world where the whole UFO phenomena

537
00:25:04,730 --> 00:25:04,380
simply never came up everything else is

538
00:25:06,650 --> 00:25:04,740
the same

539
00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:06,660
what afternoon I run into you on the

540
00:25:11,360 --> 00:25:09,570
street and I say hi Ryan how you doing

541
00:25:13,550 --> 00:25:11,370
good Peter how you doing cold funny you

542
00:25:15,750 --> 00:25:13,560
asked the damnedest thing happened to me

543
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:15,760
last night or yesterday afternoon

544
00:25:20,310 --> 00:25:17,650
I was in the yard playing with the kids

545
00:25:21,570 --> 00:25:20,320
I was on the other side of the block

546
00:25:24,060 --> 00:25:21,580
walking the dog

547
00:25:27,570 --> 00:25:24,070
I looked up and I saw this thing or

548
00:25:30,030 --> 00:25:27,580
things in the sky it was or they were

549
00:25:32,430 --> 00:25:30,040
the size of a star zigzagging around

550
00:25:35,580 --> 00:25:32,440
stopping pulsating changing color

551
00:25:38,100 --> 00:25:35,590
it was disc shaped it moved radically it

552
00:25:39,870 --> 00:25:38,110
stopped it hovered it came down and

553
00:25:41,460 --> 00:25:39,880
landed on the neighbors lawn when it

554
00:25:45,990 --> 00:25:41,470
took off I saw that there was kind of a

555
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:46,000
burn mark there it was um it was oval it

556
00:25:49,980 --> 00:25:48,010
was rectangular it was as big as two

557
00:25:53,970 --> 00:25:49,990
battleships it was as small as a star

558
00:25:59,450 --> 00:25:53,980
they made no noise I wonder what it was

559
00:26:01,770 --> 00:25:59,460
now in a otherwise sane non-judgmental

560
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:01,780
logically thinking world you would

561
00:26:07,380 --> 00:26:04,930
either say to me or think I'm making an

562
00:26:10,140 --> 00:26:07,390
educated guess here but I think it would

563
00:26:12,740 --> 00:26:10,150
probably be something like gee that's

564
00:26:16,020 --> 00:26:12,750
interesting I wonder what it was -

565
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:16,030
instead we live in a world where in most

566
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:18,490
cases if somebody says that to a

567
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:20,290
neighbor the neighbor will look at them

568
00:26:27,150 --> 00:26:23,290
they'll be too polite to say but they

569
00:26:30,210 --> 00:26:27,160
will think what's wrong with Peter has

570
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:30,220
he become mentally ill yeah is he

571
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:33,970
delusional does he want to fool me for

572
00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:36,970
some reason is he does he want to create

573
00:26:43,020 --> 00:26:40,510
a hoax to you know make people feel

574
00:26:45,510 --> 00:26:43,030
foolish does he want my favorite does he

575
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:45,520
want to feel special hmm

576
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:48,970
is he gone mystical or something

577
00:26:53,250 --> 00:26:51,850
it's reminds me of a wonderful phrase of

578
00:26:57,090 --> 00:26:53,260
dr. Wilhelm Wright's evasion of the

579
00:26:59,520 --> 00:26:57,100
obvious hello I'm right here you know

580
00:27:02,180 --> 00:26:59,530
what why don't you ask that other

581
00:27:04,770 --> 00:27:02,190
question I wonder what it was - why

582
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:04,780
because there is so much ridicule

583
00:27:11,010 --> 00:27:08,250
attached to taking UFOs seriously and

584
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:11,020
their implications for humanity and when

585
00:27:15,540 --> 00:27:13,570
I say UFOs I mean that percentage of

586
00:27:18,420 --> 00:27:15,550
unidentified flying objects that are

587
00:27:20,820 --> 00:27:18,430
genuinely and truly anomalous that are

588
00:27:24,780 --> 00:27:20,830
not explainable in any conventional

589
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:24,790
terms you and I know that most if not

590
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:27,250
the great majority of UFOs in modern

591
00:27:30,670 --> 00:27:27,890
times

592
00:27:32,170 --> 00:27:30,680
are very possibly explainable in

593
00:27:34,750 --> 00:27:32,180
conventional terms even if they're

594
00:27:38,310 --> 00:27:34,760
radical conventional terms everything

595
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:38,320
from freaky weather conditions to

596
00:27:43,630 --> 00:27:41,090
classified machines in the sky of things

597
00:27:47,230 --> 00:27:43,640
that we have that are extraordinary you

598
00:27:50,460 --> 00:27:47,240
know go down the list and so I began to

599
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:50,470
develop this paper and I thought hmm

600
00:27:57,400 --> 00:27:54,410
nice if I have an opportunity to run it

601
00:27:59,050 --> 00:27:57,410
by an informal audience and ask for

602
00:28:02,740 --> 00:27:59,060
their comments on things that can

603
00:28:06,010 --> 00:28:02,750
strengthen it also I thought this is a

604
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:06,020
doubly interesting opportunity because

605
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:09,050
if we invite an assortment of people we

606
00:28:13,870 --> 00:28:11,450
can ensure that there are some people in

607
00:28:15,670 --> 00:28:13,880
the audience who are very hip to UFO

608
00:28:20,590 --> 00:28:15,680
studies who read the books who go to the

609
00:28:23,410 --> 00:28:20,600
lectures who know me who are well versed

610
00:28:26,140 --> 00:28:23,420
and a whole bunch of other people that

611
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:26,150
have never read a UFO book that have

612
00:28:30,700 --> 00:28:28,250
never been to UFO conference who could

613
00:28:34,210 --> 00:28:30,710
care less about the subject but the

614
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:34,220
opportunity to have a friend invite them

615
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:35,930
who they know is interested in the

616
00:28:42,610 --> 00:28:39,050
subject but has only invited them in

617
00:28:44,790 --> 00:28:42,620
past for like a music recital overall

618
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:44,800
these are fairly if well-educated

619
00:28:52,900 --> 00:28:48,770
Manhattanites and we got a wonderful mix

620
00:28:57,580 --> 00:28:52,910
of people over 20 so I had a secondary

621
00:29:00,520 --> 00:28:57,590
concern which was how do I breach this

622
00:29:03,100 --> 00:29:00,530
highly specific topic because it

623
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:03,110
involves an awful lot of quotations from

624
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:04,610
classified previously classified

625
00:29:10,630 --> 00:29:08,570
documents to newspaper articles and I

626
00:29:14,290 --> 00:29:10,640
realized for some years I've wanted to

627
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:14,300
create a whole new talk and at any given

628
00:29:18,370 --> 00:29:16,250
time I'm ready to go on a dozen or 15

629
00:29:19,450 --> 00:29:18,380
different subjects usually about half of

630
00:29:22,330 --> 00:29:19,460
them at different levels of development

631
00:29:25,450 --> 00:29:22,340
other ones that are kind of stock talks

632
00:29:28,450 --> 00:29:25,460
that I'm always updating or expanding

633
00:29:32,650 --> 00:29:28,460
and other ones that occasionally a

634
00:29:34,150 --> 00:29:32,660
commission another one that is taking

635
00:29:35,730 --> 00:29:34,160
something that I was interested in years

636
00:29:39,070 --> 00:29:35,740
ago and seeing if there's anything new

637
00:29:40,810 --> 00:29:39,080
to really radically change it over but

638
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:40,820
again every once in a while an entirely

639
00:29:47,530 --> 00:29:41,690
new idea

640
00:29:50,110 --> 00:29:47,540
some kind of UFO 101 talk with a certain

641
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:50,120
caveat something that would be informal

642
00:29:55,030 --> 00:29:52,730
that would not only not be intimidating

643
00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:55,040
but that fair amount of the imagery that

644
00:30:00,940 --> 00:29:57,650
I was using would be rather light

645
00:30:02,410 --> 00:30:00,950
hearted but to make serious points the

646
00:30:05,110 --> 00:30:02,420
history of science fiction doesn't go

647
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:05,120
back to the 50s it goes back hundreds of

648
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:07,610
years and you know for people that think

649
00:30:13,420 --> 00:30:11,570
of Pulp publications in the 1950s and

650
00:30:16,750 --> 00:30:13,430
things well they had the equivalent in

651
00:30:20,130 --> 00:30:16,760
the 20s and 30s and you know 150 years

652
00:30:24,070 --> 00:30:20,140
ago you had Jules Verne you had HG Wells

653
00:30:27,460 --> 00:30:24,080
120 years ago so I wanted to create a

654
00:30:30,750 --> 00:30:27,470
talk that would be as good an

655
00:30:35,290 --> 00:30:30,760
introduction to the sweep of the subject

656
00:30:39,700 --> 00:30:35,300
for newbies as I could but the caveat

657
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:39,710
was that not only would it not be

658
00:30:43,390 --> 00:30:41,570
something that would put more learning

659
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:43,400
people to sleep but that it would be as

660
00:30:50,380 --> 00:30:46,850
engaging for them in its own way the

661
00:30:52,780 --> 00:30:50,390
original plan was going to be again the

662
00:30:55,390 --> 00:30:52,790
first talk I had never given at never

663
00:30:57,670 --> 00:30:55,400
even timed I just had my PowerPoint I

664
00:30:59,710 --> 00:30:57,680
had my bullet points and I was ready to

665
00:31:02,290 --> 00:30:59,720
go I thought I'll take an hour

666
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:02,300
well into the hour and beyond I realized

667
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:04,970
I'm still rolling on it we have a very

668
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:08,090
engaged audience nobody is getting you

669
00:31:14,110 --> 00:31:11,290
know bored check it has nodding out

670
00:31:16,420 --> 00:31:14,120
everybody seems absolutely right there

671
00:31:19,030 --> 00:31:16,430
with me all good and by the time we took

672
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:19,040
our break we realize let's just stick

673
00:31:23,980 --> 00:31:22,010
with this and William was pleased enough

674
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:23,990
with the turnout and with the dynamics

675
00:31:29,170 --> 00:31:26,210
that we decided well we'll keep doing

676
00:31:31,030 --> 00:31:29,180
this so right now to jump ahead for a

677
00:31:33,910 --> 00:31:31,040
moment it looks like we'll have another

678
00:31:36,610 --> 00:31:33,920
event probably late summer maybe in

679
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:36,620
August which I will promote on my

680
00:31:42,670 --> 00:31:39,850
Facebook page these things will have to

681
00:31:45,370 --> 00:31:42,680
unfortunately do of a limit in terms of

682
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:45,380
the number of people and the potential

683
00:31:51,970 --> 00:31:49,450
audience is huge so it will be a RSVP

684
00:31:54,630 --> 00:31:51,980
kind of situation and we you know if

685
00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:54,640
you're on my Facebook page great if not

686
00:31:59,910 --> 00:31:57,730
act me and get on and I will always post

687
00:32:04,860 --> 00:31:59,920
it on your Facebook page as well

688
00:32:07,140 --> 00:32:04,870
please etc so what we did what I did and

689
00:32:10,050 --> 00:32:07,150
I'd like to kind of walk you guys

690
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:10,060
through it because if you want to

691
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:13,210
contact Ryan or through him me and put

692
00:32:17,970 --> 00:32:15,970
in your two cents whether or not you've

693
00:32:20,460 --> 00:32:17,980
wanted to hear a talk like this or bring

694
00:32:22,740 --> 00:32:20,470
somebody to a talk like this because

695
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:22,750
you're interested and they're not

696
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:25,450
necessarily but you'd like them to

697
00:32:30,750 --> 00:32:28,090
either appreciate why you are interested

698
00:32:34,410 --> 00:32:30,760
in why you feel it's important or to

699
00:32:36,750 --> 00:32:34,420
have the bug by them and in this case it

700
00:32:37,860 --> 00:32:36,760
was particularly gratifying for me there

701
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:37,870
are quite a number of people there that

702
00:32:42,870 --> 00:32:40,450
I'd never met and lovely people there

703
00:32:45,150 --> 00:32:42,880
were people who I knew well and who know

704
00:32:47,220 --> 00:32:45,160
me well some of whom have come to my

705
00:32:50,730 --> 00:32:47,230
lectures for years and read what I write

706
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:50,740
and you know follow my work other ones

707
00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:52,570
who have known me for years and have

708
00:32:57,840 --> 00:32:56,050
never read a UFO book never attend a

709
00:33:00,060 --> 00:32:57,850
lecture of mine have no interest in the

710
00:33:02,130 --> 00:33:00,070
subject that I'm aware of

711
00:33:06,750 --> 00:33:02,140
outside of G my friend Peter is involved

712
00:33:09,930 --> 00:33:06,760
in it so what we did was I simply began

713
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:09,940
with a series of vintage science fiction

714
00:33:17,550 --> 00:33:12,490
images some of them going back to the

715
00:33:19,710 --> 00:33:17,560
1920s and 30s showing how the subject

716
00:33:22,830 --> 00:33:19,720
was depicted right now Ryan and I are

717
00:33:26,190 --> 00:33:22,840
looking at a great image from the 1920s

718
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:26,200
and it is a fully articulated flying

719
00:33:30,630 --> 00:33:28,810
saucer in space disc shaped object with

720
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:30,640
the earth in the background but it's

721
00:33:36,930 --> 00:33:34,330
from like 1928 Wow and they and we I

722
00:33:39,210 --> 00:33:36,940
just want to mention we will post these

723
00:33:40,830 --> 00:33:39,220
photos for the listeners to see one in

724
00:33:43,260 --> 00:33:40,840
the show notes so to be able to do that

725
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:43,270
would be very cruel not because the

726
00:33:48,540 --> 00:33:45,490
thing of this especially as New Yorkers

727
00:33:51,990 --> 00:33:48,550
is that the craft has all these wiry

728
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:52,000
tentacles holding on to for the

729
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:54,250
uninformed person is just a big-city

730
00:34:00,020 --> 00:33:57,370
building huh what it is in fact is the

731
00:34:03,180 --> 00:34:00,030
Woolworth Building okay and it was in

732
00:34:05,070 --> 00:34:03,190
1913 and at the time the tallest

733
00:34:07,140 --> 00:34:05,080
building in the world

734
00:34:10,230 --> 00:34:07,150
so there's your premise there they've

735
00:34:13,500 --> 00:34:10,240
hauled it out into space and again as I

736
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:13,510
go through talking about the way we in

737
00:34:16,950 --> 00:34:15,330
the field thought about these things

738
00:34:19,919 --> 00:34:16,960
it's a machine

739
00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:19,929
it's made out of metal you've got the

740
00:34:25,770 --> 00:34:23,649
equivalent of a dashboard a console and

741
00:34:28,260 --> 00:34:25,780
instead of people with a steering wheel

742
00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:28,270
you've got aliens and suits you know

743
00:34:33,030 --> 00:34:30,490
with a little stick or something but to

744
00:34:35,790 --> 00:34:33,040
ask the questions why are they visiting

745
00:34:38,669 --> 00:34:35,800
earth are there only one kind visiting

746
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:38,679
earth are they good or are they bad what

747
00:34:45,030 --> 00:34:40,690
do they want from us what's their

748
00:34:48,060 --> 00:34:45,040
relationship with us do they mean us

749
00:34:51,300 --> 00:34:48,070
well or don't they at this point I

750
00:34:54,419 --> 00:34:51,310
opened up to a degree and said I can't

751
00:34:57,660 --> 00:34:54,429
say definitively but based on decades of

752
00:35:00,030 --> 00:34:57,670
careful observation interview my own

753
00:35:03,900 --> 00:35:00,040
limited times I've seen something that

754
00:35:06,540 --> 00:35:03,910
is seems to be truly anomalous and my

755
00:35:09,150 --> 00:35:06,550
experiences are nothing in number or

756
00:35:12,140 --> 00:35:09,160
intensity to those of many people simply

757
00:35:15,450 --> 00:35:12,150
that you interviewed among others but I

758
00:35:16,530 --> 00:35:15,460
have come to an understanding at least

759
00:35:19,020 --> 00:35:16,540
with myself

760
00:35:21,860 --> 00:35:19,030
I'm as convinced as I can be number one

761
00:35:26,390 --> 00:35:21,870
that we are dealing with a myriad of

762
00:35:29,850 --> 00:35:26,400
them that there isn't just one kind of

763
00:35:32,190 --> 00:35:29,860
alien a term of never been comfortable

764
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:32,200
with in this context although it's the

765
00:35:36,950 --> 00:35:34,690
one that people understand use the most

766
00:35:40,110 --> 00:35:36,960
I usually refer to them as other

767
00:35:43,380 --> 00:35:40,120
intelligences but that they come and go

768
00:35:45,990 --> 00:35:43,390
with impunity but from where well where

769
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:46,000
do you think wherever you guess it's

770
00:35:52,530 --> 00:35:48,570
probably a possibility that's true yeah

771
00:35:54,870 --> 00:35:52,540
another planet another galaxy another

772
00:35:57,780 --> 00:35:54,880
universe another dimension from

773
00:36:00,030 --> 00:35:57,790
someplace deep in the earth to one

774
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:00,040
dimension away from where we are in this

775
00:36:04,380 --> 00:36:02,650
room right now but vibrating on a

776
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:04,390
different frequency or what have you or

777
00:36:10,410 --> 00:36:08,050
all the above with observation posts on

778
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:10,420
the moon colonies on the back of the

779
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:13,810
moon on Mars in the rings of Saturn who

780
00:36:18,870 --> 00:36:16,450
knows your guess is as good as mine

781
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:18,880
they're all valid I think

782
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:23,410
again based on observation critical

783
00:36:28,370 --> 00:36:26,050
thinking deductive reasoning my many

784
00:36:33,270 --> 00:36:28,380
years of working with Budd Hopkins that

785
00:36:35,850 --> 00:36:33,280
we can assume that they all have the

786
00:36:38,910 --> 00:36:35,860
ability to deceive us that their

787
00:36:44,820 --> 00:36:38,920
technology or their consciousnesses are

788
00:36:47,850 --> 00:36:44,830
such that they can mess with the imagery

789
00:36:51,900 --> 00:36:47,860
that they can create what we call screen

790
00:36:55,230 --> 00:36:51,910
memories yeah that what we see may be so

791
00:36:58,860 --> 00:36:55,240
shocking and they understand this that

792
00:37:00,150 --> 00:36:58,870
they put in our minds instead something

793
00:37:03,210 --> 00:37:00,160
less shocking

794
00:37:04,890 --> 00:37:03,220
although dissident disturbing then

795
00:37:07,770 --> 00:37:04,900
there's a factor that a lot of our

796
00:37:10,290 --> 00:37:07,780
colleagues don't factor in for me I

797
00:37:12,660 --> 00:37:10,300
became more focused on it years ago when

798
00:37:14,190 --> 00:37:12,670
I worked as a volunteer for wonderful

799
00:37:17,670 --> 00:37:14,200
organization called the Samaritans

800
00:37:19,980 --> 00:37:17,680
International and for eight years with

801
00:37:22,470 --> 00:37:19,990
some very needed breaks I worked out of

802
00:37:24,870 --> 00:37:22,480
their New York office where I was at

803
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:24,880
tries a crisis intervention volunteer

804
00:37:31,620 --> 00:37:28,330
Wow and for four years I worked strictly

805
00:37:33,660 --> 00:37:31,630
on the phones once a week and one month

806
00:37:36,060 --> 00:37:33,670
night a month straight through the night

807
00:37:38,430 --> 00:37:36,070
and then for the second four years I

808
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:38,440
continued that job but was also a shift

809
00:37:43,950 --> 00:37:42,010
supervisor because you go through a

810
00:37:46,140 --> 00:37:43,960
workday like this and you can be

811
00:37:46,590 --> 00:37:46,150
registered at the end of it in a

812
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:46,600
nutshell

813
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:50,170
I worked for eight years on the busiest

814
00:37:56,010 --> 00:37:53,290
suicide hotline in America and again

815
00:37:57,660 --> 00:37:56,020
crisis intervention we were not trained

816
00:37:59,820 --> 00:37:57,670
to be fake mental health professionals

817
00:38:03,360 --> 00:37:59,830
we were trained to be very good

818
00:38:05,850 --> 00:38:03,370
listeners steer toward the pain and do

819
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:05,860
the best we could without telling people

820
00:38:10,890 --> 00:38:08,530
what they should do to assist them from

821
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:10,900
stepping back from the ledge I mentioned

822
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:12,850
it for several reasons one is once I

823
00:38:18,420 --> 00:38:15,850
really got involved I spoke to the

824
00:38:21,180 --> 00:38:18,430
director discreetly and said this is

825
00:38:24,780 --> 00:38:21,190
what I do can you let me know between

826
00:38:28,290 --> 00:38:24,790
you and I if anybody ever calls the

827
00:38:30,750 --> 00:38:28,300
hotline because of an issue related to

828
00:38:32,110 --> 00:38:30,760
the UFO subjects that they've been

829
00:38:35,710 --> 00:38:32,120
abducted and there

830
00:38:40,240 --> 00:38:35,720
their wits that they've had contact

831
00:38:43,300 --> 00:38:40,250
experiences etc it never ever happened

832
00:38:44,950 --> 00:38:43,310
the ridicule factor even if you're

833
00:38:47,710 --> 00:38:44,960
calling a suicide hotline and you're

834
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:47,720
anonymous in the busiest city in North

835
00:38:54,460 --> 00:38:51,410
America exactly and in the world it says

836
00:38:56,620 --> 00:38:54,470
something about something yeah are they

837
00:38:59,950 --> 00:38:56,630
here to help us are they here to hurt us

838
00:39:02,920 --> 00:38:59,960
two weeks ago Travis Walton and they'd

839
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:02,930
known to a lot of your listeners gave a

840
00:39:09,910 --> 00:39:07,490
terrific talk in not far from your

841
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:09,920
hometown the city of Rochester New York

842
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:12,530
and upstate New York after a screening

843
00:39:16,720 --> 00:39:15,170
of the documentary film that I had the

844
00:39:19,690 --> 00:39:16,730
honor of being an Associate Producer on

845
00:39:21,490 --> 00:39:19,700
and the producer executive producer

846
00:39:24,490 --> 00:39:21,500
Jennifer Stein and I were there for

847
00:39:27,790 --> 00:39:24,500
Travis's screening and talk and when

848
00:39:29,650 --> 00:39:27,800
asked about you know motivation etc one

849
00:39:32,410 --> 00:39:29,660
of the things that he said I thought

850
00:39:36,660 --> 00:39:32,420
well that's well said and I can get

851
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:36,670
behind that is if the worst scenario

852
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:41,090
were in fact true that they not only did

853
00:39:46,060 --> 00:39:43,490
not have our best interests at heart but

854
00:39:49,750 --> 00:39:46,070
that they really did want to hurt us

855
00:39:52,090 --> 00:39:49,760
conquer us take us over eradicate us we

856
00:39:53,740 --> 00:39:52,100
wouldn't be here or we'd all be working

857
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:53,750
in the salt mines with little metal caps

858
00:39:57,370 --> 00:39:56,450
on it staring straight ahead with blank

859
00:40:01,300 --> 00:39:57,380
looks on our faces

860
00:40:04,660 --> 00:40:01,310
the good news is if they're not crazy

861
00:40:06,430 --> 00:40:04,670
with us about us we are still under the

862
00:40:08,590 --> 00:40:06,440
illusion that we have free will and

863
00:40:10,900 --> 00:40:08,600
we're carrying on doing our thing living

864
00:40:14,020 --> 00:40:10,910
our lives having our dreams that's good

865
00:40:17,460 --> 00:40:14,030
I feel that in this group of different

866
00:40:20,170 --> 00:40:17,470
ones of them they're the ones that

867
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:20,180
glorified to some degree or their

868
00:40:26,580 --> 00:40:24,050
sensibility popularized in the 1950s and

869
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:26,590
early 60s by the so called contactees

870
00:40:33,490 --> 00:40:30,170
individuals who almost predated the

871
00:40:36,730 --> 00:40:33,500
hippie movement of the 60s not so much

872
00:40:38,890 --> 00:40:36,740
with love and peace but that they are

873
00:40:43,090 --> 00:40:38,900
here in peace and it's all about love

874
00:40:44,370 --> 00:40:43,100
and you know they want us to evolve

875
00:40:46,710 --> 00:40:44,380
spirit

876
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:46,720
they want us to not despoil the earth

877
00:40:52,530 --> 00:40:49,810
they want us to you know be in harmony

878
00:40:54,210 --> 00:40:52,540
like the other creatures in the universe

879
00:40:56,850 --> 00:40:54,220
a lovely idea

880
00:40:59,430 --> 00:40:56,860
I hope it's true and some of them may

881
00:41:02,550 --> 00:40:59,440
actually you know embody that thought I

882
00:41:04,980 --> 00:41:02,560
went through images relative to contact

883
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:04,990
II movement and the welcome to space

884
00:41:09,180 --> 00:41:07,090
brothers I love this poster who will

885
00:41:11,100 --> 00:41:09,190
definitely post this one I just used to

886
00:41:12,930 --> 00:41:11,110
hang on my wall it woke up to it every

887
00:41:16,770 --> 00:41:12,940
day what the picture we're talking about

888
00:41:20,310 --> 00:41:16,780
is a iconic book cover from a book

889
00:41:23,510 --> 00:41:20,320
published in 1956 by a UFO writer named

890
00:41:27,330 --> 00:41:23,520
grey Barker who is kind of the Godfather

891
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:27,340
paranoid conspiracies in UFO studies and

892
00:41:34,020 --> 00:41:30,970
the legendary ubiquitous and now pop

893
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:34,030
culture icons the men in black and he

894
00:41:39,690 --> 00:41:38,290
had the best ever book title for a book

895
00:41:42,180 --> 00:41:39,700
you know to make you look over your

896
00:41:45,540 --> 00:41:42,190
shoulders they knew too much about

897
00:41:47,610 --> 00:41:45,550
flying saucers that's right you laugh

898
00:41:48,180 --> 00:41:47,620
but wait'll the men in black come for

899
00:41:50,460 --> 00:41:48,190
you Ryan

900
00:41:54,090 --> 00:41:50,470
is it's only a matter of time I would

901
00:41:56,550 --> 00:41:54,100
assume and from this moving on to the

902
00:41:58,500 --> 00:41:56,560
work of Jacque CLA a marvelous

903
00:42:02,120 --> 00:41:58,510
contributor to the field and truly

904
00:42:04,860 --> 00:42:02,130
independent thinker who broke the mold

905
00:42:07,380 --> 00:42:04,870
distressing the hard-core there from

906
00:42:10,260 --> 00:42:07,390
outer space and you know they're in hard

907
00:42:12,570 --> 00:42:10,270
machines of advanced technology to

908
00:42:15,780 --> 00:42:12,580
theorize about other aspects of what

909
00:42:19,290 --> 00:42:15,790
they were about where they might be from

910
00:42:21,330 --> 00:42:19,300
what their modus operandi was one of his

911
00:42:23,610 --> 00:42:21,340
earliest books had a title that summed

912
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:23,620
it up in terms of something that bud

913
00:42:29,610 --> 00:42:26,010
leave very strongly and I agree

914
00:42:35,010 --> 00:42:29,620
messengers of deception whatever else it

915
00:42:39,180 --> 00:42:35,020
is about them there are secrets behind

916
00:42:43,110 --> 00:42:39,190
what's being said that whatever the

917
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:43,120
truth is is not the primary thing that's

918
00:42:47,010 --> 00:42:45,130
being put forward and that's not

919
00:42:49,890 --> 00:42:47,020
necessarily a bad thing I talked about

920
00:42:52,110 --> 00:42:49,900
the fact that in this work where you're

921
00:42:55,350 --> 00:42:52,120
struggling with the unknown and trying

922
00:42:57,290 --> 00:42:55,360
to wrap your head around what would be

923
00:42:58,940 --> 00:42:57,300
look like miracles and magic

924
00:43:00,830 --> 00:42:58,950
we weren't in the scientific era

925
00:43:02,510 --> 00:43:00,840
although some people are not in that

926
00:43:06,980 --> 00:43:02,520
area even though they live here with us

927
00:43:09,950 --> 00:43:06,990
that that I am able to draw from and

928
00:43:11,660 --> 00:43:09,960
learn from are not from UFO studies

929
00:43:13,430 --> 00:43:11,670
they're from science fiction gene

930
00:43:16,010 --> 00:43:13,440
roddenberry for example wasn't just a

931
00:43:19,100 --> 00:43:16,020
great science fiction writer the creator

932
00:43:22,550 --> 00:43:19,110
of Star Trek of course he was a real

933
00:43:25,910 --> 00:43:22,560
visionary like HG Wells like Jules Verne

934
00:43:30,470 --> 00:43:25,920
and as anybody knows who has watched

935
00:43:33,590 --> 00:43:30,480
episodes he often used his television

936
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:33,600
series is because they they they mutated

937
00:43:39,410 --> 00:43:36,690
over the years to talk about important

938
00:43:41,630 --> 00:43:39,420
social observations human interactions I

939
00:43:44,690 --> 00:43:41,640
never really got beyond the initial two

940
00:43:49,130 --> 00:43:44,700
years I am pure Captain Kirk mr. Spock

941
00:43:52,100 --> 00:43:49,140
and I remember in one of the themes

942
00:43:54,620 --> 00:43:52,110
dealt with in one of the more came up

943
00:43:57,920 --> 00:43:54,630
fairly regularly actually has to do with

944
00:44:00,410 --> 00:43:57,930
one of the set pieces the Federation

945
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:00,420
which is the one moral the government of

946
00:44:05,450 --> 00:44:03,090
the earth I think 300 years in the

947
00:44:08,030 --> 00:44:05,460
future and another's tangent we went off

948
00:44:09,380 --> 00:44:08,040
on was 300 years in the future I think

949
00:44:12,230 --> 00:44:09,390
not we are dealing with the

950
00:44:14,930 --> 00:44:12,240
possibilities of three thousand thirty

951
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:14,940
thousand three hundred thousand three

952
00:44:21,230 --> 00:44:16,530
million 30 million years in the future

953
00:44:23,570 --> 00:44:21,240
we don't know but to assume for the sake

954
00:44:27,410 --> 00:44:23,580
of familiarity or trying to you know

955
00:44:29,750 --> 00:44:27,420
keep a contact with them that it's such

956
00:44:32,300 --> 00:44:29,760
a short distances I I think kind of

957
00:44:34,610 --> 00:44:32,310
naive in this in the world of

958
00:44:36,740 --> 00:44:34,620
Roddenberry in the Federation there was

959
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:36,750
something called the prime directive and

960
00:44:41,770 --> 00:44:39,330
what it was was when you interface with

961
00:44:46,070 --> 00:44:41,780
a culture that is less evolved than you

962
00:44:49,580 --> 00:44:46,080
never play all your cards never allow

963
00:44:52,990 --> 00:44:49,590
them to understand or see how much

964
00:44:56,180 --> 00:44:53,000
advanced you are than they are why

965
00:44:57,770 --> 00:44:56,190
because their culture will collapse now

966
00:44:58,700 --> 00:44:57,780
that wasn't just some science fiction

967
00:45:01,310 --> 00:44:58,710
premise

968
00:45:04,460 --> 00:45:01,320
I remember reading Carl Jung on this

969
00:45:06,500 --> 00:45:04,470
subject years ago interviewing somebody

970
00:45:08,270 --> 00:45:06,510
we might call a witch doctor the

971
00:45:09,360 --> 00:45:08,280
interview might have taken place in the

972
00:45:10,890 --> 00:45:09,370
20s

973
00:45:13,620 --> 00:45:10,900
referring back to something that it

974
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:13,630
happened say 30 years before in central

975
00:45:19,770 --> 00:45:15,970
Africa when British troops penetrated

976
00:45:23,010 --> 00:45:19,780
into an area where the natives had never

977
00:45:25,230 --> 00:45:23,020
ever seen an outsider and certainly not

978
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:25,240
a white person and certainly not a whole

979
00:45:31,020 --> 00:45:28,210
bunch of white people in red jackets

980
00:45:33,690 --> 00:45:31,030
with these long sticks and these weird

981
00:45:35,310 --> 00:45:33,700
hats and one question leading to another

982
00:45:37,890 --> 00:45:35,320
he said what was the impact on your

983
00:45:40,050 --> 00:45:37,900
culture on your society and I believe

984
00:45:43,380 --> 00:45:40,060
the quote very poignant was oh well our

985
00:45:46,610 --> 00:45:43,390
dreams died I mean were they gods were

986
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:46,620
they ghosts were they Devils were they

987
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:49,450
you know we all we knew is that

988
00:45:55,260 --> 00:45:51,010
everything we thought we knew was in the

989
00:45:57,240 --> 00:45:55,270
gutter and maybe that is a core of what

990
00:46:00,180 --> 00:45:57,250
we would call the threat of deception

991
00:46:02,130 --> 00:46:00,190
that runs through however if they don't

992
00:46:03,900 --> 00:46:02,140
mean us well there'd be other reasons

993
00:46:07,500 --> 00:46:03,910
why they would certainly want to deceive

994
00:46:10,980 --> 00:46:07,510
us right moving on the idea that they

995
00:46:13,620 --> 00:46:10,990
are violent and that we have to build

996
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:13,630
our defenses against the Regan's whole

997
00:46:20,190 --> 00:46:17,650
strategic shield missile shield that we

998
00:46:22,950 --> 00:46:20,200
are now unbelievably once again trotting

999
00:46:26,190 --> 00:46:22,960
out under the Trump administration in so

1000
00:46:28,770 --> 00:46:26,200
many words to create a protection zone I

1001
00:46:31,710 --> 00:46:28,780
think originally was all about this

1002
00:46:35,610 --> 00:46:31,720
mechanical hope that we could fight off

1003
00:46:38,100 --> 00:46:35,620
this exotic threat when it's it's just

1004
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:38,110
something that is the ultimate picnic

1005
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:40,210
for the military-industrial complex and

1006
00:46:44,790 --> 00:46:41,890
everybody knows it's nonsense and it

1007
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:44,800
won't work yeah but the macho

1008
00:46:49,170 --> 00:46:46,570
aggressiveness of human beings being

1009
00:46:51,930 --> 00:46:49,180
what it is I pointed out with pop

1010
00:46:54,240 --> 00:46:51,940
culture images like bad aliens and comic

1011
00:46:57,150 --> 00:46:54,250
books then going back to academic

1012
00:47:00,030 --> 00:46:57,160
reading of the time Harold Wilkins book

1013
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:00,040
flying saucers on the attack that there

1014
00:47:06,540 --> 00:47:02,770
was and remains this school of being you

1015
00:47:09,090 --> 00:47:06,550
know in the field that does feel we have

1016
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:09,100
to be worried about it I feel we do and

1017
00:47:14,250 --> 00:47:12,010
I also feel we can be open to other ones

1018
00:47:16,260 --> 00:47:14,260
because we're dealing like we're dealing

1019
00:47:18,930 --> 00:47:16,270
with people I mean as well some don't

1020
00:47:21,780 --> 00:47:18,940
and when it comes to bad aliens my

1021
00:47:23,990 --> 00:47:21,790
favorites are the Martians from the

1022
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:24,000
eight Tim Burton's Mars Attacks

1023
00:47:31,050 --> 00:47:27,490
terrifying the only film series of the

1024
00:47:34,620 --> 00:47:31,060
only film ever made based entirely on a

1025
00:47:36,180 --> 00:47:34,630
set of bubblegum cards and I wish I had

1026
00:47:38,490 --> 00:47:36,190
the whole series be worth some money

1027
00:47:41,250 --> 00:47:38,500
today I bet interestingly and I was able

1028
00:47:47,210 --> 00:47:41,260
to uncertain to the talk that Stephen

1029
00:47:50,370 --> 00:47:47,220
Hawking in 2010 or 11 made a very

1030
00:47:52,530 --> 00:47:50,380
provocative statement that he felt that

1031
00:47:55,410 --> 00:47:52,540
we should probably not even be trying to

1032
00:47:56,940 --> 00:47:55,420
contact them because if they get our

1033
00:48:01,160 --> 00:47:56,950
message they're probably well in advance

1034
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:01,170
of us that it's just too risky and that

1035
00:48:07,350 --> 00:48:05,410
like young and the the tribal elder

1036
00:48:10,230 --> 00:48:07,360
granted that there may be life-forms

1037
00:48:11,850 --> 00:48:10,240
that are so different than us that might

1038
00:48:14,340 --> 00:48:11,860
even not even recognize them because

1039
00:48:17,580 --> 00:48:14,350
they live in you know an atmosphere and

1040
00:48:19,500 --> 00:48:17,590
prybar ammonia and other horrible gases

1041
00:48:21,060 --> 00:48:19,510
that you know at three hundred and

1042
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:21,070
eighty degrees that would immolate us

1043
00:48:27,270 --> 00:48:24,450
but his feeling was that they might well

1044
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:27,280
come to us in the spirit that the first

1045
00:48:31,620 --> 00:48:29,770
Europeans came to North and South

1046
00:48:33,990 --> 00:48:31,630
America and that didn't work out very

1047
00:48:36,540 --> 00:48:34,000
well for the locals the other thing is

1048
00:48:39,990 --> 00:48:36,550
to think of the point of view it's sort

1049
00:48:42,780 --> 00:48:40,000
of a counter-reaction to the contactee

1050
00:48:45,420 --> 00:48:42,790
movement that we have become the bad

1051
00:48:47,790 --> 00:48:45,430
guys well we certainly have in terms of

1052
00:48:51,270 --> 00:48:47,800
taking care of our host organism namely

1053
00:48:53,790 --> 00:48:51,280
the earth and some of them may really

1054
00:48:55,860 --> 00:48:53,800
value this planet maybe it's a lot rarer

1055
00:48:58,770 --> 00:48:55,870
than we imagined or as rare as we

1056
00:49:01,280 --> 00:48:58,780
imagined maybe it is a Waystation

1057
00:49:05,190 --> 00:49:01,290
partway between here and someplace else

1058
00:49:08,190 --> 00:49:05,200
but that it is important to them and we

1059
00:49:11,250 --> 00:49:08,200
the host organisms are toxifying at at

1060
00:49:14,460 --> 00:49:11,260
such a rate that we may kill it for all

1061
00:49:17,390 --> 00:49:14,470
of us and that makes us look bad and it

1062
00:49:20,220 --> 00:49:17,400
should talk about a couple of famous

1063
00:49:24,210 --> 00:49:20,230
nonsensical aspects of it cults that

1064
00:49:28,650 --> 00:49:24,220
utilize the whole UFO thing like the

1065
00:49:31,710 --> 00:49:28,660
Raelians in Canada others that are more

1066
00:49:33,530 --> 00:49:31,720
vicious and then we jump cut and I took

1067
00:49:34,790 --> 00:49:33,540
the audience back

1068
00:49:37,970 --> 00:49:34,800
two thousand years sixty-five hundred

1069
00:49:40,070 --> 00:49:37,980
years whiplash two images absolutely

1070
00:49:42,980 --> 00:49:40,080
bonafide images from ancient Sumeria

1071
00:49:46,850 --> 00:49:42,990
ones that were kind of kicked off in the

1072
00:49:50,090 --> 00:49:46,860
60s by a swiss german journalist who had

1073
00:49:53,840 --> 00:49:50,100
an idea for a book looking at the

1074
00:49:55,400 --> 00:49:53,850
possibility of visitations from UFO

1075
00:49:59,630 --> 00:49:55,410
occupants going back to time immemorial

1076
00:50:01,910 --> 00:49:59,640
and he published a book called Chariots

1077
00:50:03,980 --> 00:50:01,920
of the Gods and at this point I believe

1078
00:50:07,490 --> 00:50:03,990
Erich von Daniken has sold eight

1079
00:50:09,770 --> 00:50:07,500
squadron copies in 40 languages and it's

1080
00:50:12,020 --> 00:50:09,780
so kicking ass exactly you got your copy

1081
00:50:14,180 --> 00:50:12,030
I've got my copy of right here and it's

1082
00:50:17,360 --> 00:50:14,190
it's just a publishing phenomena

1083
00:50:20,150 --> 00:50:17,370
ten years later a genuine antiquarian

1084
00:50:24,260 --> 00:50:20,160
scholar named zecharia sitchin who was a

1085
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:24,270
specialist in Sumerian texts picked up

1086
00:50:29,780 --> 00:50:27,090
the thread along with other ancient

1087
00:50:32,330 --> 00:50:29,790
scholars and wrote what I felt was an

1088
00:50:34,450 --> 00:50:32,340
important book that 12th planet that

1089
00:50:37,100 --> 00:50:34,460
brings us back to ancient Sumeria

1090
00:50:39,890 --> 00:50:37,110
understanding from his first generation

1091
00:50:42,770 --> 00:50:39,900
transcriptions of from the original

1092
00:50:45,170 --> 00:50:42,780
cuneiform which some scholars have

1093
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:45,180
called into question others accept a day

1094
00:50:50,840 --> 00:50:47,370
to day life in the world of an ancient

1095
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:50,850
Sumerian but then interesting

1096
00:51:00,380 --> 00:50:55,530
interesting usage of terms and words to

1097
00:51:02,810 --> 00:51:00,390
more than suggest that it was a society

1098
00:51:06,380 --> 00:51:02,820
of human beings with some non-human

1099
00:51:08,930 --> 00:51:06,390
beings who had sexual relations with

1100
00:51:11,750 --> 00:51:08,940
real women and created beings who would

1101
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:11,760
have us and half them referred to as

1102
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:14,490
Gods plural small G and who flew in

1103
00:51:19,430 --> 00:51:17,130
these apparatuses coming and going

1104
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:19,440
the first epic poem we have Gilgamesh

1105
00:51:26,390 --> 00:51:21,690
there are parts that can be read to

1106
00:51:29,390 --> 00:51:26,400
suggest that Gilgamesh was taken and in

1107
00:51:31,610 --> 00:51:29,400
a fiery chariot to another Kingdom off

1108
00:51:34,430 --> 00:51:31,620
the earth returned having learned

1109
00:51:36,740 --> 00:51:34,440
certain lessons and I'm showing the

1110
00:51:39,770 --> 00:51:36,750
images and while saying that I feel

1111
00:51:43,040 --> 00:51:39,780
they're provocative they're interesting

1112
00:51:46,319 --> 00:51:43,050
they don't prove anything moving on from

1113
00:51:49,829 --> 00:51:46,329
there to 3000 BC

1114
00:51:52,380 --> 00:51:49,839
and taking us to remote parts of what's

1115
00:51:55,259 --> 00:51:52,390
now modern Australia and looking at cave

1116
00:51:58,289 --> 00:51:55,269
paintings some of which have been

1117
00:52:01,169 --> 00:51:58,299
utilized to suggest that they are

1118
00:52:04,559 --> 00:52:01,179
offworld beings went off on a tangent

1119
00:52:07,259 --> 00:52:04,569
here about the very popular American

1120
00:52:11,309 --> 00:52:07,269
television show ancient aliens posted by

1121
00:52:14,519 --> 00:52:11,319
dear Giorgio and his famous hair a very

1122
00:52:16,739 --> 00:52:14,529
nice guy by the way who I'm very happy

1123
00:52:19,829 --> 00:52:16,749
with his success I I knew him back in

1124
00:52:22,650 --> 00:52:19,839
the day and not as crazy as people with

1125
00:52:25,380 --> 00:52:22,660
oh no no he's very savvy grounded normal

1126
00:52:28,650 --> 00:52:25,390
person you television people exactly and

1127
00:52:30,479 --> 00:52:28,660
again a very nice guy for me

1128
00:52:33,109 --> 00:52:30,489
ancient aliens which is one of the most

1129
00:52:36,209 --> 00:52:33,119
popular shows ever on the theme of

1130
00:52:38,069 --> 00:52:36,219
extraterrestrials etc the title that

1131
00:52:40,259 --> 00:52:38,079
they chose is a very double-edged sword

1132
00:52:42,509 --> 00:52:40,269
it's obviously been successful not just

1133
00:52:44,849 --> 00:52:42,519
in viewership but in selling commercial

1134
00:52:50,370 --> 00:52:44,859
time being a moneymaker for its network

1135
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:50,380
for producers for hosts etc and after an

1136
00:52:56,160 --> 00:52:54,130
initial season or two of seizing on what

1137
00:52:59,579 --> 00:52:56,170
I felt overall were very good examples

1138
00:53:02,849 --> 00:52:59,589
of what if like the Zecharia Sitchin's

1139
00:53:04,919 --> 00:53:02,859
books each successive book took us a

1140
00:53:07,559 --> 00:53:04,929
little bit further out into the land of

1141
00:53:10,380 --> 00:53:07,569
I'm asking you to take a greater leap of

1142
00:53:13,380 --> 00:53:10,390
faith with my interpretation when you

1143
00:53:15,449 --> 00:53:13,390
look at these cave paintings that for me

1144
00:53:17,699 --> 00:53:15,459
have the vitality of modern art I love

1145
00:53:20,279 --> 00:53:17,709
them for what they are but oh they've

1146
00:53:22,410 --> 00:53:20,289
got big black eyes and they've got what

1147
00:53:25,140 --> 00:53:22,420
can be interpreted as radiating lines

1148
00:53:28,079 --> 00:53:25,150
coming off of their heads and only a

1149
00:53:31,489 --> 00:53:28,089
suggestion of a nose and no mouth oh my

1150
00:53:34,890 --> 00:53:31,499
god the grey aliens no my first thought

1151
00:53:36,419 --> 00:53:34,900
applying deductive reason here was a

1152
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:36,429
chance with the audience to talk a

1153
00:53:40,169 --> 00:53:38,249
little about my investigative method

1154
00:53:43,079 --> 00:53:40,179
deductive reasoning is something I

1155
00:53:44,939 --> 00:53:43,089
learned through a character created by a

1156
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:44,949
British writer in the 19th century the

1157
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:47,170
writer being Arthur Conan Doyle who the

1158
00:53:52,199 --> 00:53:49,410
character being mr. Sherlock Holmes I

1159
00:53:55,289 --> 00:53:52,209
became enamored by the Holmes character

1160
00:53:58,019 --> 00:53:55,299
at about 11 or 12 years old specifically

1161
00:53:59,490 --> 00:53:58,029
from watching this series of black and

1162
00:54:01,580 --> 00:53:59,500
white films

1163
00:54:04,500 --> 00:54:01,590
with Basil Rathbone and Nigel Bruce

1164
00:54:06,690 --> 00:54:04,510
beloved representatives wonderful

1165
00:54:09,240 --> 00:54:06,700
British actors and one of the things

1166
00:54:11,700 --> 00:54:09,250
that the Holmes character practiced was

1167
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:11,710
deductive reasoning essentially my

1168
00:54:17,070 --> 00:54:14,650
investigative method is built on here's

1169
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:17,080
the mystery presented to me I am going

1170
00:54:22,670 --> 00:54:19,810
to assume that it can be solved with the

1171
00:54:24,930 --> 00:54:22,680
most mundane everyday down-to-earth

1172
00:54:26,850 --> 00:54:24,940
explanation it's like when you put

1173
00:54:27,810 --> 00:54:26,860
something down and you don't remember

1174
00:54:30,090 --> 00:54:27,820
where you put it

1175
00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:30,100
deductive reasoning suggests that you

1176
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:32,890
retrace all of your steps that you don't

1177
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:36,370
go into an exotic explanation that it D

1178
00:54:41,190 --> 00:54:39,130
materialized that the cat ate it that it

1179
00:54:44,460 --> 00:54:41,200
is gone through a fourth dimensional

1180
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:44,470
thing that an alien stole it you look

1181
00:54:50,250 --> 00:54:47,170
where you might have left it if it

1182
00:54:53,190 --> 00:54:50,260
doesn't pan out you take one step up to

1183
00:54:56,670 --> 00:54:53,200
the second most everyday explanation and

1184
00:54:58,380 --> 00:54:56,680
you repeat the process now what I don't

1185
00:55:00,950 --> 00:54:58,390
like about it is that it's boring a hell

1186
00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:00,960
and time-consuming it's not at all sexy

1187
00:55:06,930 --> 00:55:04,570
it's not fun to write about because

1188
00:55:08,990 --> 00:55:06,940
there's nothing to really tell it's it's

1189
00:55:12,690 --> 00:55:09,000
the grunt work of investigative work

1190
00:55:15,210 --> 00:55:12,700
however the trap for somebody like you

1191
00:55:17,460 --> 00:55:15,220
or I you do this work long enough you

1192
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:17,470
see what amounts to a preponderance of

1193
00:55:21,660 --> 00:55:19,570
evidence that you could take into court

1194
00:55:23,370 --> 00:55:21,670
that could put somebody in jail for

1195
00:55:25,620 --> 00:55:23,380
years that convict somebody of murder

1196
00:55:27,780 --> 00:55:25,630
and have them lose their life we have

1197
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:27,790
that kind of evidence and there are some

1198
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:29,610
of us who after a certain period of time

1199
00:55:35,520 --> 00:55:32,050
my phrase for is is that we no longer

1200
00:55:38,250 --> 00:55:35,530
have the luxury of disbelief anybody has

1201
00:55:40,980 --> 00:55:38,260
ever been taken who the hell cares what

1202
00:55:45,060 --> 00:55:40,990
intellectual point of view they may have

1203
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:45,070
about a certain book they know because

1204
00:55:49,380 --> 00:55:46,930
they've lived it but we do have

1205
00:55:52,500 --> 00:55:49,390
colleagues who because they know these

1206
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:52,510
things happen if presented with evidence

1207
00:55:59,070 --> 00:55:55,650
that's fairly exotic oh my god that

1208
00:56:01,740 --> 00:55:59,080
probably is an alien you know and that

1209
00:56:02,940 --> 00:56:01,750
an Aborigine did so that their culture

1210
00:56:06,060 --> 00:56:02,950
would remember it well

1211
00:56:08,010 --> 00:56:06,070
maybe yes maybe no but I'm far from

1212
00:56:11,490 --> 00:56:08,020
convinced and we go through some of

1213
00:56:12,630 --> 00:56:11,500
these examples that I felt they're

1214
00:56:17,339 --> 00:56:12,640
provocative

1215
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:17,349
when we're looking at right now that you

1216
00:56:23,549 --> 00:56:21,130
should post is to beings rock paintings

1217
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:23,559
what makes these beings different

1218
00:56:29,250 --> 00:56:25,930
they're radiating lines coming off their

1219
00:56:32,490 --> 00:56:29,260
head don't start at the head they start

1220
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:32,500
at another line that's drawn around the

1221
00:56:39,589 --> 00:56:36,010
head now if this was a medieval kind of

1222
00:56:43,079 --> 00:56:39,599
painting we would see you know we would

1223
00:56:45,029 --> 00:56:43,089
reference it to the kind of halo you

1224
00:56:47,460 --> 00:56:45,039
know that Mary might have or Jesus is

1225
00:56:49,470 --> 00:56:47,470
something but in this particular thing

1226
00:56:51,480 --> 00:56:49,480
we see these two being and they almost

1227
00:56:53,490 --> 00:56:51,490
seem to be floating they're interacting

1228
00:56:56,220 --> 00:56:53,500
they have things in their hand they have

1229
00:56:59,400 --> 00:56:56,230
this line drawn around their head which

1230
00:57:02,069 --> 00:56:59,410
might be interpreted as a protective

1231
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:02,079
clear thing that they're wearing and

1232
00:57:08,490 --> 00:57:05,410
lines coming off it that might be energy

1233
00:57:10,799 --> 00:57:08,500
right maybe I look at it and I think to

1234
00:57:13,460 --> 00:57:10,809
myself this partly based again on

1235
00:57:15,870 --> 00:57:13,470
critical thinking deductive reasoning a

1236
00:57:17,970 --> 00:57:15,880
knowledge of the ancient arts to a

1237
00:57:20,279 --> 00:57:17,980
degree I have a BFA in painting I've

1238
00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:20,289
taught painting for years I spent part

1239
00:57:26,339 --> 00:57:24,730
of today in the ancient Central American

1240
00:57:28,529 --> 00:57:26,349
exhibits in the museum of natural

1241
00:57:30,539 --> 00:57:28,539
history looking at masks partly just

1242
00:57:33,749 --> 00:57:30,549
thinking about some of this stuff that

1243
00:57:38,519 --> 00:57:33,759
that line surrounding the head might be

1244
00:57:41,249 --> 00:57:38,529
a a piece of wood a branch a fresh

1245
00:57:44,009 --> 00:57:41,259
branch that could be bent that could be

1246
00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:44,019
attached to a wooden armature that is

1247
00:57:48,870 --> 00:57:45,970
part of I have a small collection of

1248
00:57:51,509 --> 00:57:48,880
tribal masks that then had sticks stuck

1249
00:57:53,160 --> 00:57:51,519
into it if I have to choose between that

1250
00:57:57,140 --> 00:57:53,170
even though that sounds a little off the

1251
00:58:01,109 --> 00:57:57,150
beaten path or that this is a aboriginal

1252
00:58:04,259 --> 00:58:01,119
painting of two ancient aliens I think

1253
00:58:06,690 --> 00:58:04,269
the odds are better that it's two guys

1254
00:58:11,099 --> 00:58:06,700
with some kind of ceremonial apparatus

1255
00:58:11,999 --> 00:58:11,109
on their head but we don't know where it

1256
00:58:15,809 --> 00:58:12,009
gets interesting

1257
00:58:19,170 --> 00:58:15,819
you show some well-known fakes is um I

1258
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:19,180
bring at this point I brought my

1259
00:58:25,360 --> 00:58:24,250
audience to Nazca Peru um and we talked

1260
00:58:28,330 --> 00:58:25,370
about the fact

1261
00:58:32,070 --> 00:58:28,340
that this is one of the remote areas in

1262
00:58:36,910 --> 00:58:32,080
the Andes that there is a plateau where

1263
00:58:39,640 --> 00:58:36,920
by dint of probably laying out lines

1264
00:58:42,550 --> 00:58:39,650
with strings that ran hundreds and

1265
00:58:43,150 --> 00:58:42,560
hundreds of feet working with a master

1266
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:43,160
plan

1267
00:58:49,030 --> 00:58:46,010
they created a sophisticated series of

1268
00:58:50,920 --> 00:58:49,040
lines that suggest the kind of lines you

1269
00:58:56,380 --> 00:58:50,930
might find or think about in terms of a

1270
00:58:58,780 --> 00:58:56,390
runway but pictures of beings that could

1271
00:59:02,140 --> 00:58:58,790
only be observed from the air and the

1272
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:02,150
way the images were created was this

1273
00:59:08,620 --> 00:59:05,690
plateau is covered with temples and so

1274
00:59:11,170 --> 00:59:08,630
maybe for a width of several inches for

1275
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:11,180
hundreds of feet one direction the

1276
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:13,370
people who executed this art project

1277
00:59:19,090 --> 00:59:16,250
let's call it simply remove the temples

1278
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:19,100
within that area this is a very

1279
00:59:25,810 --> 00:59:22,610
conscious act and it suggests that the

1280
00:59:27,550 --> 00:59:25,820
people who oversaw it who created the

1281
00:59:29,020 --> 00:59:27,560
project were working with an

1282
00:59:33,220 --> 00:59:29,030
understanding that it could be

1283
00:59:34,510 --> 00:59:33,230
appreciated from only above right now

1284
00:59:37,810 --> 00:59:34,520
this is interesting

1285
00:59:39,730 --> 00:59:37,820
does that mean they saw UFOs they knew

1286
00:59:43,390 --> 00:59:39,740
there were beings in the sky obviously

1287
00:59:45,930 --> 00:59:43,400
gods or advanced beings or whatever and

1288
00:59:49,210 --> 00:59:45,940
we would make these drawings for them a

1289
00:59:52,150 --> 00:59:49,220
logical idea i showed a number of

1290
00:59:55,600 --> 00:59:52,160
pictures of how sophisticated they were

1291
00:59:59,340 --> 00:59:55,610
and how huge they were has everything

1292
01:00:02,950 --> 00:59:59,350
from a being kind of funky but basically

1293
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:02,960
humanoid you know two legs head eyes

1294
01:00:08,860 --> 01:00:04,010
that kind of thing

1295
01:00:13,140 --> 01:00:08,870
to a a monkey and monkey hip to a

1296
01:00:17,020 --> 01:00:13,150
hummingbird to a spider drawn with the

1297
01:00:20,920 --> 01:00:17,030
efficiency and the grace of a modern art

1298
01:00:23,740 --> 01:00:20,930
drawing it's one thing that as a devotee

1299
01:00:25,990 --> 01:00:23,750
of the Arts that I love about certain

1300
01:00:28,030 --> 01:00:26,000
aspects of the ancient arts and the

1301
01:00:30,730 --> 01:00:28,040
whole modernist movement there is a

1302
01:00:32,950 --> 01:00:30,740
vitality that is reflected in each other

1303
01:00:36,460 --> 01:00:32,960
and don't think for a second that people

1304
01:00:38,930 --> 01:00:36,470
like Picasso and Matisse and that whole

1305
01:00:41,589 --> 01:00:38,940
generation of early modernists

1306
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:41,599
did not know about appreciate and enjoy

1307
01:00:48,200 --> 01:00:45,450
ancient tribal arts however I guess I

1308
01:00:49,970 --> 01:00:48,210
dashed everybody's dreams with this not

1309
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:49,980
to say that it wasn't done with a

1310
01:00:56,000 --> 01:00:52,530
credible possibility of beings in the

1311
01:00:59,180 --> 01:00:56,010
sky etc but years ago National

1312
01:01:01,760 --> 01:00:59,190
Geographic did a documentary addressing

1313
01:01:03,559 --> 01:01:01,770
Nazca Plains of the mystery I loved

1314
01:01:06,440 --> 01:01:03,569
National Geographic I grew up with it

1315
01:01:08,950 --> 01:01:06,450
it's a wonderful publication they've

1316
01:01:12,380 --> 01:01:08,960
done ever so much good work in

1317
01:01:15,079 --> 01:01:12,390
popularizing exploration mysteries in

1318
01:01:17,300 --> 01:01:15,089
the world natural habitats they've done

1319
01:01:19,970 --> 01:01:17,310
wonderful work in everything except for

1320
01:01:23,599 --> 01:01:19,980
the area of UFO studies there debunkers

1321
01:01:26,420 --> 01:01:23,609
and they treat it with the sarcasm with

1322
01:01:29,630 --> 01:01:26,430
the caustic miss with the silliness with

1323
01:01:31,700 --> 01:01:29,640
the pseudoscience that the worst you

1324
01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:31,710
know pioneers of the original cover-up

1325
01:01:35,870 --> 01:01:33,450
kit and what they did though was

1326
01:01:38,930 --> 01:01:35,880
brilliant they had a premise which was

1327
01:01:44,930 --> 01:01:38,940
could was it possible that this kind of

1328
01:01:48,530 --> 01:01:44,940
imagery was created because the rulers

1329
01:01:51,650 --> 01:01:48,540
of this culture whether it was not the

1330
01:01:54,140 --> 01:01:51,660
royalty or the high priests that they

1331
01:01:56,690 --> 01:01:54,150
were able to create hundreds of years

1332
01:01:59,270 --> 01:01:56,700
before the French mastered

1333
01:02:02,210 --> 01:01:59,280
lighter-than-air flight some kind of

1334
01:02:04,339 --> 01:02:02,220
balloon that could take them up that

1335
01:02:08,870 --> 01:02:04,349
they could then observe the ground and

1336
01:02:10,670 --> 01:02:08,880
what they did son-of-a-gun with things

1337
01:02:12,890 --> 01:02:10,680
that they even though not on the plane

1338
01:02:15,620 --> 01:02:12,900
itself because it's barren but in the

1339
01:02:17,900 --> 01:02:15,630
surrounding area wicker to create a

1340
01:02:20,930 --> 01:02:17,910
basket animal skins that were thin

1341
01:02:23,839 --> 01:02:20,940
enough and connected enough that they

1342
01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:23,849
could create a balloon type shape using

1343
01:02:30,050 --> 01:02:27,210
you know hemp raffia to create ropes to

1344
01:02:32,359 --> 01:02:30,060
connect a basket to the balloon and then

1345
01:02:35,180 --> 01:02:32,369
with an understanding gained you know

1346
01:02:37,819 --> 01:02:35,190
watching nature or how fires work that

1347
01:02:40,490 --> 01:02:37,829
they could create a fire not have the

1348
01:02:43,069 --> 01:02:40,500
whole apparatus catch on fire but that a

1349
01:02:46,069 --> 01:02:43,079
heat could fill the balloon and that it

1350
01:02:49,130 --> 01:02:46,079
would float up a couple hundred feet and

1351
01:02:51,830 --> 01:02:49,140
that the king or the high priest could

1352
01:02:54,470 --> 01:02:51,840
look down and say I'm pretty spy

1353
01:02:56,660 --> 01:02:54,480
so look at that they created it I can

1354
01:02:59,060 --> 01:02:56,670
see it they know conceptually because

1355
01:03:04,040 --> 01:02:59,070
they've seen the drawings this is cool

1356
01:03:08,810 --> 01:03:04,050
it's good to be king now once again we

1357
01:03:10,760 --> 01:03:08,820
can't prove it we can't disprove it this

1358
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:10,770
is very interesting to me though it is a

1359
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:14,010
viable explanation for any true believer

1360
01:03:19,760 --> 01:03:17,130
or anyone who wants to believe that it

1361
01:03:21,790 --> 01:03:19,770
was aliens that predicated these

1362
01:03:26,870 --> 01:03:21,800
wonderful drawings on the Nazca Plains I

1363
01:03:29,330 --> 01:03:26,880
have unfortunately put a damper on that

1364
01:03:31,640 --> 01:03:29,340
dream and they may be right but this is

1365
01:03:34,460 --> 01:03:31,650
where we are at a certain point though

1366
01:03:37,040 --> 01:03:34,470
there came a tipping point for me and it

1367
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:37,050
happens well it starts in the Bible I

1368
01:03:42,170 --> 01:03:40,290
grew up in my religious tradition and

1369
01:03:45,170 --> 01:03:42,180
reformed Judaism with the understanding

1370
01:03:47,270 --> 01:03:45,180
that the Bible the Old Testament was a

1371
01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:47,280
combination of things among which

1372
01:03:55,550 --> 01:03:51,690
included myths legends morality tales

1373
01:03:58,310 --> 01:03:55,560
true stories the stories to create a

1374
01:04:01,120 --> 01:03:58,320
lesson that you could learn from taking

1375
01:04:04,630 --> 01:04:01,130
myths from earlier cultures and

1376
01:04:09,620 --> 01:04:04,640
recreating them for your new

1377
01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:09,630
judeo-christian situation and and there

1378
01:04:15,140 --> 01:04:12,930
are for me as not a terribly religious

1379
01:04:17,390 --> 01:04:15,150
person spiritual yes religious no a

1380
01:04:19,460 --> 01:04:17,400
number of areas in the Old Testament

1381
01:04:22,520 --> 01:04:19,470
that literally jump out at us and

1382
01:04:26,540 --> 01:04:22,530
suggest I'm a little different I might

1383
01:04:30,830 --> 01:04:26,550
just be some body's attempt back in the

1384
01:04:35,500 --> 01:04:30,840
day to capture and articulate a person

1385
01:04:38,330 --> 01:04:35,510
trying to express as well as they can

1386
01:04:40,580 --> 01:04:38,340
their appreciation that they're

1387
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:40,590
witnessing something totally

1388
01:04:45,410 --> 01:04:42,450
paradigm-shifting for them totally

1389
01:04:47,810 --> 01:04:45,420
life-changing that in reality is a

1390
01:04:50,660 --> 01:04:47,820
genuine anomalous event involving

1391
01:04:54,160 --> 01:04:50,670
advanced technology and beings from off

1392
01:04:58,460 --> 01:04:54,170
earth or off dimension or off whatever

1393
01:05:01,280 --> 01:04:58,470
Ezekiel's wheel is the one that I find

1394
01:05:03,470 --> 01:05:01,290
the most intriguing and maybe twenty

1395
01:05:04,770 --> 01:05:03,480
years ago because this is the way I'm

1396
01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:04,780
wired up

1397
01:05:10,110 --> 01:05:07,810
decided to do a little study of it I had

1398
01:05:12,270 --> 01:05:10,120
my own version of the Old Testament the

1399
01:05:14,850 --> 01:05:12,280
Hebrew Union one little book that I was

1400
01:05:16,760 --> 01:05:14,860
given when I was bar mitzvah'd I went to

1401
01:05:19,590 --> 01:05:16,770
our local library and I took out several

1402
01:05:20,910 --> 01:05:19,600
versions of the Old Testament I have

1403
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:20,920
friends who are different kinds of

1404
01:05:24,720 --> 01:05:22,570
Christians and I borrowed Bibles from

1405
01:05:27,480 --> 01:05:24,730
them and I ended up with like seven

1406
01:05:33,500 --> 01:05:27,490
different versions of the Old Testament

1407
01:05:36,180 --> 01:05:33,510
I went to Ezekiel and I read each Bibles

1408
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:36,190
translation of Ezekiel from beginning to

1409
01:05:41,850 --> 01:05:39,010
end my surprise was how little they

1410
01:05:44,700 --> 01:05:41,860
differed from each other only in minutia

1411
01:05:46,700 --> 01:05:44,710
essentially it's Ezekiel's minding his

1412
01:05:49,050 --> 01:05:46,710
own business and low in the heavens

1413
01:05:51,510 --> 01:05:49,060
cometh something a wheel within a wheel

1414
01:05:55,290 --> 01:05:51,520
of the appearance of burnished beryllium

1415
01:05:57,960 --> 01:05:55,300
ie metal it comes down we know it's

1416
01:06:00,150 --> 01:05:57,970
round it has eyes all about I wonder

1417
01:06:03,690 --> 01:06:00,160
what they could have meant by eyes all

1418
01:06:06,930 --> 01:06:03,700
about maybe windows like on a modern

1419
01:06:09,930 --> 01:06:06,940
craft or something but it's metallic it

1420
01:06:13,590 --> 01:06:09,940
comes down it kicks up the sand and out

1421
01:06:16,980 --> 01:06:13,600
of it lo emerges an angel number one the

1422
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:16,990
word angel we think of it I mean we hear

1423
01:06:22,110 --> 01:06:19,330
it and we immediately apply it to the

1424
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:22,120
world of theology to religious and

1425
01:06:27,870 --> 01:06:24,690
mystical imagery to that positive

1426
01:06:30,330 --> 01:06:27,880
ethereal spirit with the big wings that

1427
01:06:33,990 --> 01:06:30,340
help save people and they're God's

1428
01:06:36,780 --> 01:06:34,000
messengers etc the first use we have of

1429
01:06:40,290 --> 01:06:36,790
the word angel that we can identify is

1430
01:06:43,320 --> 01:06:40,300
in Sumerian even if there are cultures

1431
01:06:45,330 --> 01:06:43,330
on this earth to thrive 40,000 years ago

1432
01:06:47,760 --> 01:06:45,340
four hundred thousand years ago forty

1433
01:06:49,500 --> 01:06:47,770
million years ago the earliest language

1434
01:06:51,390 --> 01:06:49,510
form we have and can begin to wrap our

1435
01:06:53,420 --> 01:06:51,400
heads around is samarium the word angel

1436
01:06:55,650 --> 01:06:53,430
had nothing to do with religion and

1437
01:06:57,630 --> 01:06:55,660
where it would have been as comfortable

1438
01:07:00,080 --> 01:06:57,640
as any other word would have been in the

1439
01:07:02,490 --> 01:07:00,090
halls of power in Washington in

1440
01:07:05,760 --> 01:07:02,500
Parliament in the United Nations

1441
01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:05,770
it means emissary or go-between but the

1442
01:07:10,890 --> 01:07:08,410
angel cometh from the wheel within a

1443
01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:10,900
wheel with the eyes all around and it is

1444
01:07:16,740 --> 01:07:13,930
encased in burnished beryllium ie a suit

1445
01:07:17,940 --> 01:07:16,750
that seems metallic it has a head but on

1446
01:07:19,829 --> 01:07:17,950
one side of the head is a lie

1447
01:07:22,950 --> 01:07:19,839
on the other side is another animal well

1448
01:07:25,500 --> 01:07:22,960
here we are we're landing on this planet

1449
01:07:27,780 --> 01:07:25,510
of simple beings let's just say that we

1450
01:07:30,180 --> 01:07:27,790
have a mission that we want to affect

1451
01:07:32,790 --> 01:07:30,190
their culture in a way that will help

1452
01:07:35,010 --> 01:07:32,800
them to evolve intellectually and

1453
01:07:36,839 --> 01:07:35,020
morally and we're going to impart some

1454
01:07:39,510 --> 01:07:36,849
thoughts to them again like a Star Trek

1455
01:07:42,020 --> 01:07:39,520
episode and I'm out maybe some people

1456
01:07:43,710 --> 01:07:42,030
may think I met outrageously

1457
01:07:46,470 --> 01:07:43,720
inappropriate here in making this

1458
01:07:49,109 --> 01:07:46,480
suggestion but a lot of people would

1459
01:07:52,349 --> 01:07:49,119
also disagree with me in the 1970s

1460
01:07:55,440 --> 01:07:52,359
somebody who was very interested in this

1461
01:07:57,089 --> 01:07:55,450
idea had read the seminal book that woke

1462
01:07:59,370 --> 01:07:57,099
a lot of folks up relative to this at

1463
01:08:02,400 --> 01:07:59,380
the time Erich von Daniken's Chariots of

1464
01:08:03,900 --> 01:08:02,410
the Gods was talking about Ezekiel and

1465
01:08:07,079 --> 01:08:03,910
his feelings about it with a friend of

1466
01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:07,089
his who could have cared less joseph

1467
01:08:12,240 --> 01:08:10,690
blumrich was a NASA system designer who

1468
01:08:15,420 --> 01:08:12,250
had worked on the lunar landing module

1469
01:08:19,050 --> 01:08:15,430
who was an engineer who could give two

1470
01:08:21,150 --> 01:08:19,060
S's about the whole idea of ancient

1471
01:08:23,970 --> 01:08:21,160
astronauts and things and was ready to

1472
01:08:26,670 --> 01:08:23,980
dismiss it but as I recall kind of on

1473
01:08:29,459 --> 01:08:26,680
partly a dare partly a whim reread

1474
01:08:33,079 --> 01:08:29,469
Ezekiel or read Ezekiel and was shocked

1475
01:08:36,209 --> 01:08:33,089
to see with just a little bit of

1476
01:08:39,570 --> 01:08:36,219
latitude that he could allow himself as

1477
01:08:46,229 --> 01:08:39,580
an engineer that when he was reading

1478
01:08:50,940 --> 01:08:46,239
about was a module it was a machine made

1479
01:08:53,940 --> 01:08:50,950
to land made to takeoff and he worked up

1480
01:08:56,039 --> 01:08:53,950
a schematic of it and he published a

1481
01:08:58,229 --> 01:08:56,049
book that's a minor classic anybody

1482
01:08:59,940 --> 01:08:58,239
interested in the UFO subject should

1483
01:09:02,010 --> 01:08:59,950
have it in their library and like many

1484
01:09:03,870 --> 01:09:02,020
good books that are out of print you can

1485
01:09:06,440 --> 01:09:03,880
find it online for couple of bucks yeah

1486
01:09:09,809 --> 01:09:06,450
paperback copy occasionally a hardcover

1487
01:09:14,190 --> 01:09:09,819
it's called the spaceships of ezekiel by

1488
01:09:17,039 --> 01:09:14,200
josef blumrich BL um RI CH as I remember

1489
01:09:20,099 --> 01:09:17,049
again I am working an audience on

1490
01:09:22,170 --> 01:09:20,109
Saturday a folks that have never thought

1491
01:09:23,700 --> 01:09:22,180
about some of this stuff along with

1492
01:09:26,370 --> 01:09:23,710
people who have thought about it a lot

1493
01:09:29,550 --> 01:09:26,380
you know as a public speaker you and I

1494
01:09:31,559 --> 01:09:29,560
both have had training as actors you've

1495
01:09:34,319 --> 01:09:31,569
used it I have

1496
01:09:37,740 --> 01:09:34,329
never use it to act but I've used it to

1497
01:09:39,749 --> 01:09:37,750
know enough as a public speaker that if

1498
01:09:43,319 --> 01:09:39,759
I chose to act up there it would be a

1499
01:09:45,990 --> 01:09:43,329
disastrous decision I know to keep out

1500
01:09:48,450 --> 01:09:46,000
of my own way in terms of the emotion

1501
01:09:51,149 --> 01:09:48,460
that comes up in my voice if I'm feeling

1502
01:09:53,370 --> 01:09:51,159
something I never sit on it that

1503
01:09:58,530 --> 01:09:53,380
audience knows it I don't play tough guy

1504
01:10:01,760 --> 01:09:58,540
and oppose that I'm above this but you

1505
01:10:04,350 --> 01:10:01,770
let the passion come through and you

1506
01:10:06,720 --> 01:10:04,360
understand that form is important as

1507
01:10:08,819 --> 01:10:06,730
content you can be dealing with the most

1508
01:10:11,040 --> 01:10:08,829
interesting subject matter but

1509
01:10:13,939 --> 01:10:11,050
remembering you know a teacher that you

1510
01:10:17,069 --> 01:10:13,949
had one teacher in elementary school

1511
01:10:19,350 --> 01:10:17,079
middle school high school college that

1512
01:10:22,649 --> 01:10:19,360
made a difference part of the reason was

1513
01:10:25,770 --> 01:10:22,659
they got to you with the information

1514
01:10:28,050 --> 01:10:25,780
that they wanted to impress on you but

1515
01:10:32,189 --> 01:10:28,060
in order to do that they did it with a

1516
01:10:34,979 --> 01:10:32,199
certain style or a little humor or real

1517
01:10:39,359 --> 01:10:34,989
passion and it's incumbent on people

1518
01:10:43,350 --> 01:10:39,369
like us if we want to help people step

1519
01:10:45,870 --> 01:10:43,360
through that door into I didn't believe

1520
01:10:47,580 --> 01:10:45,880
it it's not that I believe it now I am

1521
01:10:50,959 --> 01:10:47,590
open to taking it seriously

1522
01:10:55,530 --> 01:10:50,969
and that's a huge change for me yeah

1523
01:10:58,649 --> 01:10:55,540
went over other Bible stories but then

1524
01:11:02,040 --> 01:10:58,659
we come to the Year seven seventy six or

1525
01:11:05,069 --> 01:11:02,050
seven sixty-six and I show the audience

1526
01:11:11,669 --> 01:11:05,079
of fresco from like the Norman invasion

1527
01:11:14,660 --> 01:11:11,679
times it is a soldier a Saxon and his

1528
01:11:21,030 --> 01:11:14,670
arms are raised and in the sky above him

1529
01:11:24,780 --> 01:11:21,040
in a very simple form is something that

1530
01:11:28,470 --> 01:11:24,790
for me is a game changer it could be a

1531
01:11:31,919 --> 01:11:28,480
satellite it could be a ship it's

1532
01:11:34,530 --> 01:11:31,929
encased in you know lines that show it's

1533
01:11:36,450 --> 01:11:34,540
going in one direction propulsion I can

1534
01:11:39,479 --> 01:11:36,460
yeah it's like a modern art depiction

1535
01:11:40,979 --> 01:11:39,489
but for me and again that's what I'm

1536
01:11:43,020 --> 01:11:40,989
trying to get the audience here I'm a

1537
01:11:45,300 --> 01:11:43,030
free thinker don't believe me

1538
01:11:49,500 --> 01:11:45,310
think for yourself but

1539
01:11:52,290 --> 01:11:49,510
is why this is impelling to me this is

1540
01:11:53,340 --> 01:11:52,300
different then you say to yourself again

1541
01:11:55,440 --> 01:11:53,350
you don't have to be some kind of

1542
01:11:57,990 --> 01:11:55,450
scholar you simply need to be a human

1543
01:11:59,310 --> 01:11:58,000
being that can self perceive and try to

1544
01:12:03,270 --> 01:11:59,320
put yourself in the spot of another

1545
01:12:06,330 --> 01:12:03,280
human being this impacted on somebody to

1546
01:12:09,480 --> 01:12:06,340
such a degree that they felt they had to

1547
01:12:09,870 --> 01:12:09,490
commit it to paper or parchment or what

1548
01:12:13,620 --> 01:12:09,880
have you

1549
01:12:15,960 --> 01:12:13,630
now the other thing to always keep in

1550
01:12:18,360 --> 01:12:15,970
mind especially in this period on here

1551
01:12:21,900 --> 01:12:18,370
is the preponderance of religious

1552
01:12:23,670 --> 01:12:21,910
imagery yes almost all visual arts for

1553
01:12:28,290 --> 01:12:23,680
hundreds of years through this period of

1554
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:28,300
time into the 18th century was in the

1555
01:12:35,370 --> 01:12:31,690
service of the church or commissions for

1556
01:12:39,170 --> 01:12:35,380
wealthy people this is not that so at

1557
01:12:42,690 --> 01:12:39,180
this point we go to 1350 a large

1558
01:12:45,690 --> 01:12:42,700
religious fresco of the crucifixion on

1559
01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:45,700
the wall of a Yugoslavian monastery

1560
01:12:53,550 --> 01:12:48,610
except in the upper right and the upper

1561
01:12:56,210 --> 01:12:53,560
left we have two crafts one in each

1562
01:13:00,840 --> 01:12:56,220
corner and crafts is what they are and

1563
01:13:04,550 --> 01:13:00,850
they have beings in them now is there a

1564
01:13:08,040 --> 01:13:04,560
way that we can look at this and say oh

1565
01:13:10,620 --> 01:13:08,050
it's an allegorical image that they

1566
01:13:13,350 --> 01:13:10,630
thought there were people in comments

1567
01:13:15,690 --> 01:13:13,360
piloting them absolutely possible why

1568
01:13:18,420 --> 01:13:15,700
not and we're going to make it into a

1569
01:13:19,890 --> 01:13:18,430
stylized thing like this this is not

1570
01:13:23,130 --> 01:13:19,900
that much different than a very famous

1571
01:13:26,970 --> 01:13:23,140
image from it's either Incan or Mayan

1572
01:13:30,270 --> 01:13:26,980
culture of what looks like a native

1573
01:13:32,490 --> 01:13:30,280
Central American in a capsule with a lot

1574
01:13:34,980 --> 01:13:32,500
of technology with their foot pedal with

1575
01:13:38,390 --> 01:13:34,990
the hand on a tiller this is simpler but

1576
01:13:41,730 --> 01:13:38,400
these two things for me are very

1577
01:13:44,460 --> 01:13:41,740
provocative again they don't push me

1578
01:13:47,550 --> 01:13:44,470
over the edge but like that previous one

1579
01:13:50,700 --> 01:13:47,560
from 766 they do take me to the edge

1580
01:13:54,360 --> 01:13:50,710
unlike the much more theoretical ho-hum

1581
01:13:56,010 --> 01:13:54,370
it's not a you know a guy with charcoal

1582
01:13:58,680 --> 01:13:56,020
under his eyes and six coming out of his

1583
01:13:59,220 --> 01:13:58,690
hair it's definitely an alien then we

1584
01:14:01,350 --> 01:13:59,230
come to the

1585
01:14:05,760 --> 01:14:01,360
one that everything changes around for

1586
01:14:09,120 --> 01:14:05,770
me 15th century credited to a master

1587
01:14:12,479 --> 01:14:09,130
painter named lippy Li PPI it's a

1588
01:14:15,320 --> 01:14:12,489
Madonna and Child a condo in other words

1589
01:14:19,250 --> 01:14:15,330
with a circular framing device and

1590
01:14:23,010 --> 01:14:19,260
whether it's baby Jesus and one of the

1591
01:14:24,360 --> 01:14:23,020
early followers as a child or not is

1592
01:14:28,350 --> 01:14:24,370
open speculation

1593
01:14:30,870 --> 01:14:28,360
it's a classic mid-1400s

1594
01:14:34,050 --> 01:14:30,880
depiction of Mary with their hands in

1595
01:14:37,400 --> 01:14:34,060
prayer except in the upper right up in

1596
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:37,410
the sky is something and just below it

1597
01:14:45,630 --> 01:14:41,530
there's something on earth when we look

1598
01:14:50,540 --> 01:14:45,640
closer what we see is that the something

1599
01:14:55,710 --> 01:14:50,550
ain't an image of a religious being it

1600
01:14:56,580 --> 01:14:55,720
isn't a comet it isn't a depiction of an

1601
01:15:01,740 --> 01:14:56,590
angel

1602
01:15:06,080 --> 01:15:01,750
it's a oval-shaped thing with radiating

1603
01:15:08,760 --> 01:15:06,090
lines coming off of it then for me as

1604
01:15:11,220 --> 01:15:08,770
somebody who painted passionately for 10

1605
01:15:13,380 --> 01:15:11,230
years if it hadn't been for obsession

1606
01:15:15,000 --> 01:15:13,390
with this crazy subject I'd like to

1607
01:15:18,420 --> 01:15:15,010
think I'd be a successful painter

1608
01:15:21,870 --> 01:15:18,430
somewhere in lower Manhattan with homes

1609
01:15:25,979 --> 01:15:21,880
in Paris nice and wherever else I wanted

1610
01:15:28,350 --> 01:15:25,989
it never too late right but bearing in

1611
01:15:30,360 --> 01:15:28,360
mind that before the 1830s if you are a

1612
01:15:32,990 --> 01:15:30,370
painter you're realistic thinker

1613
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:33,000
people didn't paint abstracts and

1614
01:15:40,500 --> 01:15:37,330
whatever you did if you are newer you

1615
01:15:43,560 --> 01:15:40,510
may well have had a made a living doing

1616
01:15:46,650 --> 01:15:43,570
Commission's for the church at that same

1617
01:15:49,620 --> 01:15:46,660
time taking commissions from wealthy

1618
01:15:53,940 --> 01:15:49,630
people to do their portraits let's just

1619
01:15:55,229 --> 01:15:53,950
say you like a modern one of the many

1620
01:15:59,190 --> 01:15:55,239
people that you interviewed for your

1621
01:16:02,520 --> 01:15:59,200
book had had a profoundly unambiguous

1622
01:16:03,450 --> 01:16:02,530
UFO sighting and you couldn't stop

1623
01:16:05,220 --> 01:16:03,460
thinking about it

1624
01:16:09,780 --> 01:16:05,230
you're out with your dog when it

1625
01:16:12,160 --> 01:16:09,790
happened and you thought about it enough

1626
01:16:16,720 --> 01:16:12,170
and you realize it was important enough

1627
01:16:18,640 --> 01:16:16,730
and that you as a social chronicler you

1628
01:16:20,650 --> 01:16:18,650
were the camera that it was important

1629
01:16:23,140 --> 01:16:20,660
enough that you felt you had to put it

1630
01:16:27,520 --> 01:16:23,150
in an image that would move into the

1631
01:16:30,010 --> 01:16:27,530
future and so you painted yourself where

1632
01:16:31,680 --> 01:16:30,020
you were on the hillside in the

1633
01:16:34,840 --> 01:16:31,690
background of this Madonna and Child

1634
01:16:37,210 --> 01:16:34,850
with your dog and you're both looking up

1635
01:16:38,590 --> 01:16:37,220
at it your hand is over here shaving

1636
01:16:41,410 --> 01:16:38,600
your eyes you can't believe what you're

1637
01:16:44,340 --> 01:16:41,420
seeing because you've never seen

1638
01:16:48,490 --> 01:16:44,350
anything like it it's something it's

1639
01:16:52,360 --> 01:16:48,500
real it's advanced you don't know what a

1640
01:16:56,950 --> 01:16:52,370
machine is on a certain level but this

1641
01:16:58,660 --> 01:16:56,960
is not natural this for me is one of the

1642
01:17:01,660 --> 01:16:58,670
most important paintings ever made in

1643
01:17:03,970 --> 01:17:01,670
history it was considered so important

1644
01:17:06,610 --> 01:17:03,980
20 odd years ago when Laurance

1645
01:17:08,740 --> 01:17:06,620
Rockefeller obsessed with the subject

1646
01:17:12,310 --> 01:17:08,750
was working with a small group of

1647
01:17:16,060 --> 01:17:12,320
equally committed individuals to try to

1648
01:17:18,310 --> 01:17:16,070
create an awareness and a groundswell

1649
01:17:21,750 --> 01:17:18,320
among our highest elected and appointed

1650
01:17:25,150 --> 01:17:21,760
officials to take the subject seriously

1651
01:17:29,050 --> 01:17:25,160
and Lawrence paid for the production of

1652
01:17:32,890 --> 01:17:29,060
a really elegant volume I think 500

1653
01:17:35,770 --> 01:17:32,900
copies were printed called UFOs the best

1654
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:35,780
evidence it's possible to find a

1655
01:17:40,540 --> 01:17:37,970
paperback copy I forget what it came out

1656
01:17:42,700 --> 01:17:40,550
as a paperback but Don Berliner of the

1657
01:17:45,580 --> 01:17:42,710
fund for UFO research and Antonio Bonet

1658
01:17:48,700 --> 01:17:45,590
Asst put it together and they're both to

1659
01:17:51,370 --> 01:17:48,710
be credited for that but it went out to

1660
01:17:53,470 --> 01:17:51,380
the president the vice president Joint

1661
01:17:55,420 --> 01:17:53,480
Chiefs of Staff the cabinet members

1662
01:17:57,730 --> 01:17:55,430
every member of Congress in the Senate

1663
01:17:59,650 --> 01:17:57,740
key people and military industrial

1664
01:18:02,560 --> 01:17:59,660
complex world leaders around the world

1665
01:18:04,750 --> 01:18:02,570
it made no difference but featured

1666
01:18:06,610 --> 01:18:04,760
prominently in this beautifully bound

1667
01:18:09,460 --> 01:18:06,620
beautifully printed book was a

1668
01:18:11,530 --> 01:18:09,470
full-color painting of the painting

1669
01:18:13,900 --> 01:18:11,540
about you know a picture of the painting

1670
01:18:17,410 --> 01:18:13,910
we're looking at now for me this is a

1671
01:18:21,700 --> 01:18:17,420
game-changer and we moved on from here

1672
01:18:25,870 --> 01:18:21,710
to talk about the overflights in Germany

1673
01:18:28,479 --> 01:18:25,880
in 1599 that they created broadsides of

1674
01:18:30,700 --> 01:18:28,489
to show something that was so important

1675
01:18:33,100 --> 01:18:30,710
to people at the time that they felt it

1676
01:18:36,490 --> 01:18:33,110
should be committed broadsides basically

1677
01:18:38,740 --> 01:18:36,500
were single sheets with an image printed

1678
01:18:40,390 --> 01:18:38,750
on them it might have text you know to

1679
01:18:42,490 --> 01:18:40,400
tell you about an important event or it

1680
01:18:43,990 --> 01:18:42,500
might just be a picture and the most

1681
01:18:46,510 --> 01:18:44,000
famous one the one that we're looking at

1682
01:18:49,780 --> 01:18:46,520
now that that you listeners will see on

1683
01:18:52,120 --> 01:18:49,790
Ryan's website for the show is a famous

1684
01:18:55,090 --> 01:18:52,130
one in UFO studies there are written

1685
01:18:56,590 --> 01:18:55,100
accounts monasteries kept the best

1686
01:18:59,229 --> 01:18:56,600
written accounts throughout the dark

1687
01:19:02,290 --> 01:18:59,239
ages in the Middle Ages and the number

1688
01:19:04,600 --> 01:19:02,300
of credible descriptions of what we'll

1689
01:19:07,540 --> 01:19:04,610
have to call UFO events have come to us

1690
01:19:11,100 --> 01:19:07,550
from those scholarly sources for me

1691
01:19:14,140 --> 01:19:11,110
there's another great pair one in a

1692
01:19:16,270 --> 01:19:14,150
fresco that I don't have my notes with

1693
01:19:20,260 --> 01:19:16,280
me here I think it was in Central Europe

1694
01:19:22,090 --> 01:19:20,270
and it shows credibly not just a

1695
01:19:25,120 --> 01:19:22,100
disc-shaped object hovering over a

1696
01:19:28,060 --> 01:19:25,130
building but one that is articulated in

1697
01:19:30,820 --> 01:19:28,070
a way where you can see it's either

1698
01:19:35,110 --> 01:19:30,830
panels or striations in other words it's

1699
01:19:39,100 --> 01:19:35,120
not just a disc-shaped object it's it's

1700
01:19:42,750 --> 01:19:39,110
a certain model of a flying machine or

1701
01:19:47,979 --> 01:19:42,760
to design you know this is interesting

1702
01:19:49,930 --> 01:19:47,989
it's early 1600s then we I was lucky

1703
01:19:51,550 --> 01:19:49,940
enough and this bit of research was

1704
01:19:54,250 --> 01:19:51,560
turned up by our friends at open mind

1705
01:19:57,250 --> 01:19:54,260
some years ago in an article on you know

1706
01:19:59,800 --> 01:19:57,260
ancient possibilities and what they had

1707
01:20:01,840 --> 01:19:59,810
on earth I've been floating around I had

1708
01:20:03,669 --> 01:20:01,850
seen images but they produced a good one

1709
01:20:06,729 --> 01:20:03,679
was a medallion that was struck in

1710
01:20:09,490 --> 01:20:06,739
France I think in I don't know 1680 but

1711
01:20:11,700 --> 01:20:09,500
in the 17th century and it shows the

1712
01:20:15,340 --> 01:20:11,710
same goddamn thing oh my gosh it's

1713
01:20:18,399 --> 01:20:15,350
absolutely the identical model well to

1714
01:20:21,459 --> 01:20:18,409
the one from the monastery years earlier

1715
01:20:25,300 --> 01:20:21,469
in another country for me once again

1716
01:20:28,930 --> 01:20:25,310
this is the real deal this is exciting

1717
01:20:33,580 --> 01:20:28,940
this is provocative this can convince me

1718
01:20:39,470 --> 01:20:33,590
of a visitation again I can't prove it

1719
01:20:42,050 --> 01:20:39,480
but I could see that my audience

1720
01:20:44,270 --> 01:20:42,060
not only got the point but that people I

1721
01:20:46,820 --> 01:20:44,280
knew who were well versed in the general

1722
01:20:48,380 --> 01:20:46,830
subject and people that this was I'd

1723
01:20:50,390 --> 01:20:48,390
like to thank an evening that they won't

1724
01:20:52,459 --> 01:20:50,400
soon forget that opened their minds to

1725
01:20:55,520 --> 01:20:52,469
the possibilities that they were all

1726
01:20:58,100 --> 01:20:55,530
reacting the same this one does push it

1727
01:21:00,290 --> 01:20:58,110
over the edge and that's exciting then

1728
01:21:02,990 --> 01:21:00,300
what I did was I I made a jump cut

1729
01:21:06,830 --> 01:21:03,000
basically from a rather beautiful and

1730
01:21:08,990 --> 01:21:06,840
poignant 17th century painting of it's

1731
01:21:12,800 --> 01:21:09,000
sort of a religious scene on the ground

1732
01:21:17,320 --> 01:21:12,810
it I'm going to say that it's Jesus with

1733
01:21:20,150 --> 01:21:17,330
a woman who is kind of bowing down and

1734
01:21:23,209 --> 01:21:20,160
there is a beatific light shining down

1735
01:21:25,250 --> 01:21:23,219
on them from above but the source of the

1736
01:21:28,729 --> 01:21:25,260
light is not an opening in the clouds or

1737
01:21:32,510 --> 01:21:28,739
the Sun it is a fully articulated disc

1738
01:21:35,360 --> 01:21:32,520
shaped object at this point I introduce

1739
01:21:37,669 --> 01:21:35,370
to the audience the notion that if you

1740
01:21:40,760 --> 01:21:37,679
grew up Catholic you'd know this is just

1741
01:21:43,700 --> 01:21:40,770
part of your litany education is

1742
01:21:46,450 --> 01:21:43,710
Catholic if not is such an important

1743
01:21:49,220 --> 01:21:46,460
cultural event in the early 20th century

1744
01:21:51,830 --> 01:21:49,230
that it transcended religious

1745
01:21:57,100 --> 01:21:51,840
constrictions namely the miracle of

1746
01:21:59,900 --> 01:21:57,110
Fatima in I think 1918 and 19 several

1747
01:22:03,650 --> 01:21:59,910
sheepherders children illiterate

1748
01:22:07,160 --> 01:22:03,660
observed what they called a vision of

1749
01:22:09,169 --> 01:22:07,170
the Virgin Mary in the sky and they fell

1750
01:22:11,540 --> 01:22:09,179
to their knees and they prayed to her

1751
01:22:14,360 --> 01:22:11,550
and they felt that you know that

1752
01:22:17,720 --> 01:22:14,370
something important had happened when we

1753
01:22:19,760 --> 01:22:17,730
look at the actual description because

1754
01:22:22,520 --> 01:22:19,770
they spoke to a number of people who

1755
01:22:25,010 --> 01:22:22,530
took they became world famous this was

1756
01:22:28,310 --> 01:22:25,020
seen as certainly one of the greatest

1757
01:22:30,530 --> 01:22:28,320
Catholic miracles of the previous

1758
01:22:33,439 --> 01:22:30,540
several hundred years yeah the miracle

1759
01:22:35,870 --> 01:22:33,449
of Fatima you know is the real deal

1760
01:22:37,640 --> 01:22:35,880
absolutely but what did they actually

1761
01:22:40,850 --> 01:22:37,650
see yeah and when you read those

1762
01:22:44,150 --> 01:22:40,860
accounts period accounts direct from the

1763
01:22:46,760 --> 01:22:44,160
kids what they saw was not a beautiful

1764
01:22:51,220 --> 01:22:46,770
image of Mary in the sky what they saw

1765
01:22:54,790 --> 01:22:51,230
was a Glatt large glowing disk

1766
01:22:58,810 --> 01:22:54,800
and this is a version of that so partly

1767
01:23:01,600 --> 01:22:58,820
for again I'm doing this with you guys

1768
01:23:04,300 --> 01:23:01,610
on this radio show I'm doing a few Ryan

1769
01:23:08,350 --> 01:23:04,310
but this is unusual for me to put

1770
01:23:11,860 --> 01:23:08,360
together a brand new talk and to try to

1771
01:23:13,510 --> 01:23:11,870
think it through and how is this going

1772
01:23:15,850 --> 01:23:13,520
to be most effective one thing that you

1773
01:23:18,520 --> 01:23:15,860
find out as an investigative writer as a

1774
01:23:21,910 --> 01:23:18,530
writer is you can put the same

1775
01:23:25,810 --> 01:23:21,920
information down in you know a brief

1776
01:23:29,590 --> 01:23:25,820
summation of paragraph in a page in a

1777
01:23:32,770 --> 01:23:29,600
chapter in entire book but there is an

1778
01:23:34,990 --> 01:23:32,780
art to what order you put what if you

1779
01:23:37,810 --> 01:23:35,000
put something incredibly provocative and

1780
01:23:39,910 --> 01:23:37,820
challenging too early before you've

1781
01:23:43,330 --> 01:23:39,920
given your readers a chance to acquire

1782
01:23:45,070 --> 01:23:43,340
the tools to wrap their heads around

1783
01:23:46,990 --> 01:23:45,080
what you're going to present it will

1784
01:23:48,700 --> 01:23:47,000
blow their fuses and you're not going to

1785
01:23:51,010 --> 01:23:48,710
make your point it may even develop some

1786
01:23:52,600 --> 01:23:51,020
resentment and you lost a very important

1787
01:23:55,750 --> 01:23:52,610
opportunity because you're not going to

1788
01:23:58,750 --> 01:23:55,760
get it again so I'm thinking to myself I

1789
01:24:00,550 --> 01:23:58,760
want to now continue the role of my

1790
01:24:03,910 --> 01:24:00,560
narrative which obviously is fairly

1791
01:24:07,210 --> 01:24:03,920
freewheeling but do it in a way with a

1792
01:24:10,300 --> 01:24:07,220
little bit of drama but not height and

1793
01:24:12,580 --> 01:24:10,310
so what I do what I did on Saturday was

1794
01:24:16,630 --> 01:24:12,590
I jumped from the painting I just

1795
01:24:20,320 --> 01:24:16,640
described I think early 18th century

1796
01:24:24,030 --> 01:24:20,330
painting to a photograph taken in Brazil

1797
01:24:27,130 --> 01:24:24,040
in 1952 of a brilliantly articulated

1798
01:24:29,650 --> 01:24:27,140
disc-shaped object at this point I

1799
01:24:32,500 --> 01:24:29,660
explained briefly to the audience that

1800
01:24:36,610 --> 01:24:32,510
if you want to see images of UFOs just

1801
01:24:39,880 --> 01:24:36,620
go online type you know flying saucers

1802
01:24:43,600 --> 01:24:39,890
or UFO pictures photographs and you'll

1803
01:24:47,500 --> 01:24:43,610
get a tee squad drill Ian of the problem

1804
01:24:51,370 --> 01:24:47,510
being that almost all of them come

1805
01:24:54,490 --> 01:24:51,380
without any provenance any photographers

1806
01:24:57,190 --> 01:24:54,500
any knowledge of their character the

1807
01:25:00,070 --> 01:24:57,200
circumstances where it was taken the

1808
01:25:03,190 --> 01:25:00,080
time the day the witnesses if any blah

1809
01:25:04,210 --> 01:25:03,200
blah blah any snook who knows basic

1810
01:25:06,370 --> 01:25:04,220
Photoshop can

1811
01:25:09,000 --> 01:25:06,380
create an image that is compelling and

1812
01:25:13,300 --> 01:25:09,010
that's cool and that's a shame because

1813
01:25:15,820 --> 01:25:13,310
unless you know a professional photo

1814
01:25:19,450 --> 01:25:15,830
analyst or are one yourself you can be

1815
01:25:23,200 --> 01:25:19,460
hard pressed to go anywhere with the

1816
01:25:28,480 --> 01:25:23,210
image so I often rely on black and white

1817
01:25:31,180 --> 01:25:28,490
pre digital 1950s 1960s photographs to

1818
01:25:34,060 --> 01:25:31,190
make my photographic points when I move

1819
01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:34,070
into the world of color film and digital

1820
01:25:41,410 --> 01:25:39,050
photographs I try to know my source who

1821
01:25:43,510 --> 01:25:41,420
the photographer was if possible know

1822
01:25:46,360 --> 01:25:43,520
something about the photographer the

1823
01:25:49,030 --> 01:25:46,370
circumstances the character etc in the

1824
01:25:52,870 --> 01:25:49,040
old days and I began you know looking at

1825
01:25:53,950 --> 01:25:52,880
the subject in the 1970s I you know was

1826
01:25:56,920 --> 01:25:53,960
looking at black and white in color

1827
01:25:59,260 --> 01:25:56,930
photos but they were all analog chemical

1828
01:26:03,340 --> 01:25:59,270
print photos one thing that I learned

1829
01:26:05,770 --> 01:26:03,350
early on on my own reinforced by one of

1830
01:26:09,670 --> 01:26:05,780
my early mentors Coleman Vodka vasuki

1831
01:26:12,010 --> 01:26:09,680
who was a retired colonel staff officer

1832
01:26:13,450 --> 01:26:12,020
of the Royal Hungarian army and during

1833
01:26:15,820 --> 01:26:13,460
World War two in charge of photo

1834
01:26:18,030 --> 01:26:15,830
analysis photo reconnaissance photo

1835
01:26:21,400 --> 01:26:18,040
education very knowledgeable man about

1836
01:26:23,890 --> 01:26:21,410
photography man was a consultant for

1837
01:26:26,860 --> 01:26:23,900
many years in the States if this was a

1838
01:26:29,490 --> 01:26:26,870
fake and what we had done would to

1839
01:26:32,980 --> 01:26:29,500
create this wonderful image of a UFO

1840
01:26:35,020 --> 01:26:32,990
either photographed a model very good or

1841
01:26:37,990 --> 01:26:35,030
done a really nice effect of drawing

1842
01:26:40,330 --> 01:26:38,000
then cut it out with a scissor then

1843
01:26:42,520 --> 01:26:40,340
glued it down with a standard 10 power

1844
01:26:42,910 --> 01:26:42,530
glass you could see the edge of the

1845
01:26:45,850 --> 01:26:42,920
paper

1846
01:26:47,920 --> 01:26:45,860
would have been cut when the fakers

1847
01:26:50,560 --> 01:26:47,930
started to realize that they might hold

1848
01:26:53,230 --> 01:26:50,570
it and then work at the edge with a

1849
01:26:55,750 --> 01:26:53,240
graphite pencil so it was now dark

1850
01:26:58,030 --> 01:26:55,760
instead of light but you'd still see

1851
01:27:01,360 --> 01:26:58,040
slightly raised off the surface of

1852
01:27:04,960 --> 01:27:01,370
course this doesn't come into play when

1853
01:27:08,110 --> 01:27:04,970
we have a digital image so what I did

1854
01:27:10,180 --> 01:27:08,120
was go through some of the finest you

1855
01:27:12,730 --> 01:27:10,190
know not the sexiest but some of the

1856
01:27:14,740 --> 01:27:12,740
finest authentic images that we have I

1857
01:27:15,580 --> 01:27:14,750
talked a bit about dr. Bruce Maccabee

1858
01:27:18,340 --> 01:27:15,590
who for

1859
01:27:21,010 --> 01:27:18,350
decades was the go-to-guy informally I

1860
01:27:23,590 --> 01:27:21,020
guess still in photo analysis Bruce

1861
01:27:25,720 --> 01:27:23,600
being an optical physicist who worked

1862
01:27:26,920 --> 01:27:25,730
for over 30 years as a consultant to the

1863
01:27:29,380 --> 01:27:26,930
United States Navy

1864
01:27:32,530 --> 01:27:29,390
many of these photos of the classics

1865
01:27:35,110 --> 01:27:32,540
that I showed had been through hundreds

1866
01:27:38,200 --> 01:27:35,120
of hours of authentic photo analysis and

1867
01:27:40,000 --> 01:27:38,210
had the real stories attached we knew

1868
01:27:42,010 --> 01:27:40,010
about the photographers we knew about

1869
01:27:44,680 --> 01:27:42,020
the situation's we knew how many

1870
01:27:46,300 --> 01:27:44,690
witnesses and where and that they were

1871
01:27:49,390 --> 01:27:46,310
the real deal

1872
01:27:52,360 --> 01:27:49,400
some of them the famous Washington DC /

1873
01:27:55,300 --> 01:27:52,370
flight I here made a point of telling

1874
01:27:57,790 --> 01:27:55,310
the audience you need to know that this

1875
01:27:59,680 --> 01:27:57,800
is a colorized photo I'm a film lover

1876
01:28:01,810 --> 01:27:59,690
I really hate colorization in the old

1877
01:28:03,580 --> 01:28:01,820
black-and-white movies I'm not crazy

1878
01:28:06,370 --> 01:28:03,590
about it and photographs unless it's

1879
01:28:10,290 --> 01:28:06,380
sort of for an art reason but there came

1880
01:28:12,550 --> 01:28:10,300
a time in 1952 when a fleet of

1881
01:28:15,280 --> 01:28:12,560
unidentified truly anomalous objects

1882
01:28:17,890 --> 01:28:15,290
came down over Washington DC and hung

1883
01:28:20,050 --> 01:28:17,900
over the Capitol building thousands of

1884
01:28:22,090 --> 01:28:20,060
people saw them they were photographed

1885
01:28:24,580 --> 01:28:22,100
and rephotographed it was hours before

1886
01:28:27,160 --> 01:28:24,590
the Air Force got a plane up and this

1887
01:28:27,940 --> 01:28:27,170
was the excuse this should have changed

1888
01:28:29,650 --> 01:28:27,950
the world

1889
01:28:32,110 --> 01:28:29,660
it didn't I'm showing you this

1890
01:28:33,460 --> 01:28:32,120
photograph colorize because the famous

1891
01:28:36,040 --> 01:28:33,470
version of it is black and white of

1892
01:28:37,150 --> 01:28:36,050
course so that you can think for a

1893
01:28:38,680 --> 01:28:37,160
minute I could have been one of those

1894
01:28:40,660 --> 01:28:38,690
people and my grandfather could have

1895
01:28:42,850 --> 01:28:40,670
been one of those people and seen that

1896
01:28:44,410 --> 01:28:42,860
that would have changed the way they

1897
01:28:47,350 --> 01:28:44,420
thought about this subject forever

1898
01:28:50,500 --> 01:28:47,360
how come something didn't happen again

1899
01:28:52,420 --> 01:28:50,510
remembering that in my imagination this

1900
01:28:54,250 --> 01:28:52,430
talk was going to be fairly succinct and

1901
01:28:56,710 --> 01:28:54,260
brief and then I was going to go into

1902
01:28:58,660 --> 01:28:56,720
the origin of the ridicule factor but

1903
01:29:01,960 --> 01:28:58,670
it's it's on its own I realized at the

1904
01:29:04,360 --> 01:29:01,970
end it stands up for itself yeah once I

1905
01:29:07,030 --> 01:29:04,370
completed going through what I

1906
01:29:10,000 --> 01:29:07,040
considered some of the finest most

1907
01:29:12,010 --> 01:29:10,010
authentic UFO photos ever taken and

1908
01:29:14,200 --> 01:29:12,020
where possible talking about the

1909
01:29:16,630 --> 01:29:14,210
photographers at least briefly and the

1910
01:29:18,190 --> 01:29:16,640
circumstances that I was aware of we

1911
01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:18,200
looked at a couple of the possibilities

1912
01:29:24,160 --> 01:29:20,570
of things that have been mistaken for

1913
01:29:27,190 --> 01:29:24,170
UFOs and I always try to stress to my

1914
01:29:29,020 --> 01:29:27,200
audiences if it comes up that I'm

1915
01:29:32,800 --> 01:29:29,030
convinced lawn convinced

1916
01:29:34,840 --> 01:29:32,810
that some most perhaps at this point the

1917
01:29:36,610 --> 01:29:34,850
great majority of things that are seen

1918
01:29:39,000 --> 01:29:36,620
where people go oh my god it's an

1919
01:29:41,380 --> 01:29:39,010
unidentified flying object are likely

1920
01:29:45,940 --> 01:29:41,390
more likely explainable in conventional

1921
01:29:48,460 --> 01:29:45,950
terms to quote our friend and mentor the

1922
01:29:51,640 --> 01:29:48,470
senior guy in the world on UFOs right

1923
01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:51,650
now and an inspiration to me Stanton and

1924
01:29:57,880 --> 01:29:55,010
Friedman lecture writer author retired

1925
01:30:01,120 --> 01:29:57,890
nuclear physicist the question is not

1926
01:30:04,240 --> 01:30:01,130
are UFOs advanced technology from other

1927
01:30:08,230 --> 01:30:04,250
planets the question is has one ever

1928
01:30:11,910 --> 01:30:08,240
been and of course more than one has

1929
01:30:16,750 --> 01:30:11,920
ever been but lenticular clouds

1930
01:30:19,450 --> 01:30:16,760
reflections off of the low you know a

1931
01:30:21,970 --> 01:30:19,460
weather system so many different things

1932
01:30:24,820 --> 01:30:21,980
I point out one specific of physical

1933
01:30:29,290 --> 01:30:24,830
evidence associated with the famous test

1934
01:30:31,570 --> 01:30:29,300
case and then move on to kind of sum

1935
01:30:35,470 --> 01:30:31,580
things up using a series of all

1936
01:30:38,080 --> 01:30:35,480
political cartoons from the 1950s where

1937
01:30:39,790 --> 01:30:38,090
the media was somewhat obsessed with the

1938
01:30:43,270 --> 01:30:39,800
subject but doing anything they could

1939
01:30:46,330 --> 01:30:43,280
put it down at the same time it was like

1940
01:30:49,660 --> 01:30:46,340
a scab that they couldn't not pick it

1941
01:30:52,150 --> 01:30:49,670
was used as an allegory of the soaring

1942
01:30:55,000 --> 01:30:52,160
cost of living you know a disc flying

1943
01:30:55,720 --> 01:30:55,010
into the air or the soaring cost of

1944
01:30:58,930 --> 01:30:55,730
coffee

1945
01:31:01,780 --> 01:30:58,940
where your saucer also had a cup get it

1946
01:31:04,660 --> 01:31:01,790
ha ha and my favorite a political

1947
01:31:07,480 --> 01:31:04,670
cartoon of three aliens in a saucer well

1948
01:31:10,360 --> 01:31:07,490
in the cup in a saucer and below them in

1949
01:31:12,010 --> 01:31:10,370
the distance is the earth and the

1950
01:31:16,380 --> 01:31:12,020
caption of one of them is saying to the

1951
01:31:24,910 --> 01:31:22,480
this was the Chicago you know maker

1952
01:31:27,190 --> 01:31:24,920
means I think right Chicago some that it

1953
01:31:30,510 --> 01:31:27,200
originally published it where we go from

1954
01:31:33,370 --> 01:31:30,520
there is i summed up was how seriously

1955
01:31:37,420 --> 01:31:33,380
government agencies have taken this over

1956
01:31:39,540 --> 01:31:37,430
the decades while demeaning it making

1957
01:31:42,290 --> 01:31:39,550
fun of it putting forward their

1958
01:31:44,810 --> 01:31:42,300
pseudoscience i showed a picture of

1959
01:31:47,870 --> 01:31:44,820
a poster that one a monthly contest 'add

1960
01:31:50,330 --> 01:31:47,880
Defense Intelligence Agency of a little

1961
01:31:53,690 --> 01:31:50,340
flying saucer with a dome with an alien

1962
01:31:56,240 --> 01:31:53,700
in the dome crashing into a filing

1963
01:31:58,760 --> 01:31:56,250
cabinet text being security is no

1964
01:32:00,170 --> 01:31:58,770
accident and has to be practiced I want

1965
01:32:03,740 --> 01:32:00,180
to believe

1966
01:32:06,440 --> 01:32:03,750
official government schematics in this

1967
01:32:08,210 --> 01:32:06,450
case one how do you report you know a

1968
01:32:10,310 --> 01:32:08,220
missile an incoming missile an enemy

1969
01:32:14,630 --> 01:32:10,320
ship an enemy plane and when we look

1970
01:32:18,350 --> 01:32:14,640
also how do you report a space ship for

1971
01:32:20,960 --> 01:32:18,360
a flying saucer is it hostile is it's

1972
01:32:22,970 --> 01:32:20,970
officious unidentified and it's classed

1973
01:32:23,600 --> 01:32:22,980
right in there with submarines and enemy

1974
01:32:27,710 --> 01:32:23,610
aircraft

1975
01:32:30,530 --> 01:32:27,720
there eight I then show a few documents

1976
01:32:33,110 --> 01:32:30,540
legally Declassified from different

1977
01:32:36,170 --> 01:32:33,120
agencies and talk about how they should

1978
01:32:39,100 --> 01:32:36,180
have had they we lived in a world that

1979
01:32:41,210 --> 01:32:39,110
was reflexive when this was Declassified

1980
01:32:45,920 --> 01:32:41,220
one we're looking at here is a very

1981
01:32:48,440 --> 01:32:45,930
famous July early July 1947 FBI document

1982
01:32:50,560 --> 01:32:48,450
it was Declassified technically before

1983
01:32:54,020 --> 01:32:50,570
we had a Freedom of Information Act

1984
01:32:56,000 --> 01:32:54,030
under that we did get under President

1985
01:32:57,530 --> 01:32:56,010
Carter wonderful contribution although

1986
01:33:00,500 --> 01:32:57,540
they've tightened up on it tremendously

1987
01:33:03,260 --> 01:33:00,510
but what we have here is a document in

1988
01:33:06,950 --> 01:33:03,270
which a special agent is talking about

1989
01:33:09,890 --> 01:33:06,960
the disc phenomena and that the army you

1990
01:33:12,230 --> 01:33:09,900
know has been looking into it and that

1991
01:33:14,390 --> 01:33:12,240
there have been fakes and you know

1992
01:33:17,900 --> 01:33:14,400
should we look the second-in-command

1993
01:33:19,850 --> 01:33:17,910
Clyde Tolson who probably was J edgar

1994
01:33:22,940 --> 01:33:19,860
Hoover's lover a whole nother story

1995
01:33:25,910 --> 01:33:22,950
there he Celt at the time that they

1996
01:33:28,220 --> 01:33:25,920
shouldn't look into it because of the

1997
01:33:30,040 --> 01:33:28,230
ridicule factor because people were

1998
01:33:33,620 --> 01:33:30,050
already making front of it that early on

1999
01:33:36,860 --> 01:33:33,630
the fact is Tolson was wrong there was

2000
01:33:39,740 --> 01:33:36,870
maybe one fabrication that we knew of

2001
01:33:43,460 --> 01:33:39,750
all of the other reports seemed to be

2002
01:33:45,320 --> 01:33:43,470
authentic but where this document goes

2003
01:33:48,020 --> 01:33:45,330
completely off the rails in the most

2004
01:33:50,600 --> 01:33:48,030
amazing way possible is in the written

2005
01:33:53,420 --> 01:33:50,610
statement in his inimitable handwriting

2006
01:33:56,060 --> 01:33:53,430
J Edgar Hoover who says you know I would

2007
01:33:57,950 --> 01:33:56,070
do it but before agreeing to it we must

2008
01:34:00,680 --> 01:33:57,960
insist upon full access to disks

2009
01:34:02,839 --> 01:34:00,690
recovered what the eff look full access

2010
01:34:05,120 --> 01:34:02,849
to disks recovered why this is the head

2011
01:34:07,970 --> 01:34:05,130
of the FBI here in the first week of

2012
01:34:10,939 --> 01:34:07,980
July of 1947 a week after Roswell and

2013
01:34:13,339 --> 01:34:10,949
then saying for instance in the LA or sa

2014
01:34:15,609 --> 01:34:13,349
case the army grabbed it and wouldn't

2015
01:34:19,850 --> 01:34:15,619
let us have it for cursory examination

2016
01:34:23,359 --> 01:34:19,860
this document which the FBI has never

2017
01:34:26,180 --> 01:34:23,369
denied his real was Declassified quietly

2018
01:34:28,910 --> 01:34:26,190
I believe in the 1970s found his place

2019
01:34:31,700 --> 01:34:28,920
in the National Archives was on earth by

2020
01:34:35,750 --> 01:34:31,710
UFO researchers just publishing this

2021
01:34:38,990 --> 01:34:35,760
it's real it's factual J Edgar Hoover

2022
01:34:41,720 --> 01:34:39,000
here is talking about getting access to

2023
01:34:44,149 --> 01:34:41,730
the docket to these crashed UFO yeah and

2024
01:34:46,189 --> 01:34:44,159
in fact a week or so later in the

2025
01:34:48,859 --> 01:34:46,199
reference to general Shingen which comes

2026
01:34:50,780 --> 01:34:48,869
earlier in this document who is an Army

2027
01:34:53,149 --> 01:34:50,790
General very involved at the beginning

2028
01:34:57,109 --> 01:34:53,159
of the cover-up we have an equally

2029
01:35:01,580 --> 01:34:57,119
bonafide document a communication from

2030
01:35:04,700 --> 01:35:01,590
Julian to Hoover saying within a matter

2031
01:35:07,430 --> 01:35:04,710
of a week or two or so that the FBI

2032
01:35:09,500 --> 01:35:07,440
would be given full access to discs

2033
01:35:11,959 --> 01:35:09,510
recovered now whether or not that

2034
01:35:14,930 --> 01:35:11,969
remained over the decades we can only

2035
01:35:17,839 --> 01:35:14,940
question but early on in that summer of

2036
01:35:21,050 --> 01:35:17,849
47 a week two weeks three weeks after

2037
01:35:23,300 --> 01:35:21,060
Roswell we have this exchange this

2038
01:35:24,950 --> 01:35:23,310
should have blown the lid this would

2039
01:35:29,240 --> 01:35:24,960
have been the ultimate WikiLeaks thing

2040
01:35:32,030 --> 01:35:29,250
what happened nothing happened then talk

2041
01:35:33,649 --> 01:35:32,040
about project sign and here's we're

2042
01:35:38,030 --> 01:35:33,659
really getting into the end of the talk

2043
01:35:40,609 --> 01:35:38,040
project sign was the first actual full

2044
01:35:42,740 --> 01:35:40,619
report conducted by the then brand-new

2045
01:35:45,649 --> 01:35:42,750
United States Air Force their material

2046
01:35:47,870 --> 01:35:45,659
command division report about the UFO

2047
01:35:49,760 --> 01:35:47,880
phenomena if there was another one it

2048
01:35:52,040 --> 01:35:49,770
was so highly classified that we don't

2049
01:35:53,629 --> 01:35:52,050
even know it existed I tend to doubt it

2050
01:35:58,040 --> 01:35:53,639
it would have taken some months to do

2051
01:36:00,350 --> 01:35:58,050
this it was issued that summer of 49 I

2052
01:36:02,750 --> 01:36:00,360
think it's nice to blow that up I forget

2053
01:36:07,160 --> 01:36:02,760
48 or 49 looks like 40 yeah I think

2054
01:36:09,400 --> 01:36:07,170
we're in 48 and what we have here is 40

2055
01:36:12,730 --> 01:36:09,410
pages mostly a bureaucratic

2056
01:36:15,610 --> 01:36:12,740
been going on and on of what it isn't

2057
01:36:18,340 --> 01:36:15,620
and what it couldn't be and why couldn't

2058
01:36:23,470 --> 01:36:18,350
be and then about 30 odd pages in well

2059
01:36:25,150 --> 01:36:23,480
25 pages in we get a page and then a few

2060
01:36:27,610 --> 01:36:25,160
other references on a few following

2061
01:36:29,410 --> 01:36:27,620
pages that look like they were lifted

2062
01:36:30,700 --> 01:36:29,420
from the original working script of the

2063
01:36:35,140 --> 01:36:30,710
day the earth citizen

2064
01:36:38,380 --> 01:36:35,150
we have some personnel who emerges and

2065
01:36:40,720 --> 01:36:38,390
says something is so jaw-dropping to me

2066
01:36:43,690 --> 01:36:40,730
that it is it's one of the most

2067
01:36:47,200 --> 01:36:43,700
important statements ever made it's made

2068
01:36:47,790 --> 01:36:47,210
in the winter of 1948 and it goes like

2069
01:36:49,810 --> 01:36:47,800
this

2070
01:36:52,570 --> 01:36:49,820
spaceships the following considerations

2071
01:36:54,970 --> 01:36:52,580
pertain and they talk about if there is

2072
01:36:57,580 --> 01:36:54,980
an extraterrestrial civilization that

2073
01:36:58,660 --> 01:36:57,590
you know it's probability is it's more

2074
01:37:02,140 --> 01:36:58,670
advanced than ours

2075
01:37:04,930 --> 01:37:02,150
then quote-unquote such a civilization

2076
01:37:06,940 --> 01:37:04,940
might observe that on earth we now have

2077
01:37:10,330 --> 01:37:06,950
atomic bombs and are fast developing

2078
01:37:11,320 --> 01:37:10,340
rockets in view of the past history of

2079
01:37:15,010 --> 01:37:11,330
mankind

2080
01:37:18,220 --> 01:37:15,020
they should be alarmed therefore we

2081
01:37:22,810 --> 01:37:18,230
should therefore expect at this time

2082
01:37:26,410 --> 01:37:22,820
above all to behold such visitations Wow

2083
01:37:29,890 --> 01:37:26,420
it's mind-blowing yeah I remember how

2084
01:37:32,830 --> 01:37:29,900
excited I was when I got this document

2085
01:37:35,050 --> 01:37:32,840
in my library 30 years ago I thought I'm

2086
01:37:37,990 --> 01:37:35,060
sitting on something really important

2087
01:37:40,600 --> 01:37:38,000
here I'm doing important work surely in

2088
01:37:42,910 --> 01:37:40,610
the next years somebody in major media

2089
01:37:44,530 --> 01:37:42,920
is going to discover this and this is

2090
01:37:45,130 --> 01:37:44,540
going to bust it off yeah yeah never

2091
01:37:47,830 --> 01:37:45,140
happened

2092
01:37:51,130 --> 01:37:47,840
talked about the mania of cover-up and

2093
01:37:53,260 --> 01:37:51,140
one of my favorite anecdotes that Stan

2094
01:37:54,760 --> 01:37:53,270
Freeman probably sued the government for

2095
01:37:58,030 --> 01:37:54,770
more documents than anybody in the

2096
01:38:02,260 --> 01:37:58,040
history I think that at the NSA the

2097
01:38:04,870 --> 01:38:02,270
folks who are involved in keeping some

2098
01:38:08,530 --> 01:38:04,880
of these secrets it began to dawn on

2099
01:38:11,320 --> 01:38:08,540
them that blacking out huge tracts of

2100
01:38:14,610 --> 01:38:11,330
pages made it look like they were hiding

2101
01:38:17,710 --> 01:38:14,620
something and it looks kind of well

2102
01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:17,720
repressive um you know we're looking at

2103
01:38:23,129 --> 01:38:19,850
a page here that has like four words and

2104
01:38:25,709 --> 01:38:23,139
a lot of big honkin blackouts

2105
01:38:27,540 --> 01:38:25,719
and what they started to do and I think

2106
01:38:29,549 --> 01:38:27,550
in their minds living in their own

2107
01:38:31,850 --> 01:38:29,559
little insular world they may well have

2108
01:38:35,129 --> 01:38:31,860
believed that it would make a difference

2109
01:38:37,379 --> 01:38:35,139
they started using wite-out yeah and so

2110
01:38:39,959 --> 01:38:37,389
you have pages that look like snow just

2111
01:38:43,979 --> 01:38:39,969
blank paper huh but they're beautiful

2112
01:38:47,850 --> 01:38:43,989
snowflakes they're nicer very less nasty

2113
01:38:51,899 --> 01:38:47,860
than the obvious blackened yeah then I

2114
01:38:54,409 --> 01:38:51,909
close on this note in the late 70s I was

2115
01:38:57,600 --> 01:38:54,419
into the subject for a few years NASA

2116
01:39:00,270 --> 01:38:57,610
had put out a catalog I think it could

2117
01:39:05,310 --> 01:39:00,280
buy it for a buck it had hundreds of

2118
01:39:07,620 --> 01:39:05,320
little numbers that correspond to a line

2119
01:39:09,929 --> 01:39:07,630
of text about where a certain photo was

2120
01:39:11,850 --> 01:39:09,939
taken essentially what they did was they

2121
01:39:14,489 --> 01:39:11,860
drew from the thousands and thousands

2122
01:39:17,489 --> 01:39:14,499
and tens of thousands of photos that had

2123
01:39:21,029 --> 01:39:17,499
been taken over the preceding years with

2124
01:39:23,669 --> 01:39:21,039
passes around the moon and as close as

2125
01:39:27,089 --> 01:39:23,679
they could get to Mars of the surface

2126
01:39:30,689 --> 01:39:27,099
and you could order a photo from NASA

2127
01:39:34,020 --> 01:39:30,699
they were a dollar each but it wasn't a

2128
01:39:37,319 --> 01:39:34,030
print I mean it was an old-fashioned

2129
01:39:39,449 --> 01:39:37,329
eight by ten glossy chemical print

2130
01:39:41,729 --> 01:39:39,459
photograph they used Hasselblad

2131
01:39:43,500 --> 01:39:41,739
equipment on on all the space shots

2132
01:39:46,290 --> 01:39:43,510
state of the art certainly right up

2133
01:39:49,259 --> 01:39:46,300
there with like an icon the best objects

2134
01:39:53,250 --> 01:39:49,269
in the world and they made these

2135
01:39:55,949 --> 01:39:53,260
available to space buffs a word I don't

2136
01:39:57,509 --> 01:39:55,959
understand it always seems condescending

2137
01:39:59,040 --> 01:39:57,519
but anybody who is interested could

2138
01:40:01,139 --> 01:39:59,050
order some of these pictures and look at

2139
01:40:03,959 --> 01:40:01,149
the surface of the Moon pretty close up

2140
01:40:06,149 --> 01:40:03,969
from 300 miles up I grew up with the

2141
01:40:08,339 --> 01:40:06,159
father who was a jeweler and from the

2142
01:40:10,439 --> 01:40:08,349
time I was a little boy I had my own 10

2143
01:40:15,089 --> 01:40:10,449
power loop like another kid would have a

2144
01:40:18,449 --> 01:40:15,099
magnifying glass and at the time myself

2145
01:40:21,299 --> 01:40:18,459
Pete Missoula tough no-nonsense New York

2146
01:40:23,609 --> 01:40:21,309
City police detective who was one of my

2147
01:40:27,930 --> 01:40:23,619
mentors and a great UFO investigator and

2148
01:40:32,680 --> 01:40:27,940
Tonio næss early scholar

2149
01:40:35,500 --> 01:40:32,690
70s 80s and on from there and one or two

2150
01:40:39,370 --> 01:40:35,510
other friends together we ordered I

2151
01:40:42,580 --> 01:40:39,380
don't know a dozen or you know 20 prints

2152
01:40:44,830 --> 01:40:42,590
and then we all looked at them you know

2153
01:40:47,950 --> 01:40:44,840
I'm finished with these you look at

2154
01:40:50,950 --> 01:40:47,960
these I went over every millimeter I

2155
01:40:52,990 --> 01:40:50,960
could with my little loom and I

2156
01:40:56,490 --> 01:40:53,000
discovered a couple things that made my

2157
01:40:58,750 --> 01:40:56,500
jaw drop what we all quickly realized

2158
01:41:02,050 --> 01:40:58,760
before the catalog was withdrawn from

2159
01:41:06,130 --> 01:41:02,060
circulation and the program stopped was

2160
01:41:07,980 --> 01:41:06,140
that when NASA as a public service put

2161
01:41:10,930 --> 01:41:07,990
this idea together and got it out there

2162
01:41:14,620 --> 01:41:10,940
there was no way they had the manpower

2163
01:41:16,570 --> 01:41:14,630
or maybe even thought through maybe we

2164
01:41:20,290 --> 01:41:16,580
better have somebody or several people

2165
01:41:22,750 --> 01:41:20,300
look at every square micron of each one

2166
01:41:25,330 --> 01:41:22,760
of these photos to make sure there's

2167
01:41:26,650 --> 01:41:25,340
nothing that might be embarrassing well

2168
01:41:32,460 --> 01:41:26,660
there was some stuff that was very

2169
01:41:36,430 --> 01:41:32,470
embarrassing it was men it was was not a

2170
01:41:38,650 --> 01:41:36,440
fractal it was not you know the old man

2171
01:41:42,040 --> 01:41:38,660
in the mountain it was not Jesus in the

2172
01:41:44,380 --> 01:41:42,050
tortilla chip it was not a face in a

2173
01:41:47,140 --> 01:41:44,390
branch all that stuff is real and it

2174
01:41:51,720 --> 01:41:47,150
happens and sometimes shockingly so but

2175
01:41:55,200 --> 01:41:51,730
there are things configurations objects

2176
01:41:59,620 --> 01:41:55,210
structures on the surface of Mars and

2177
01:42:01,540 --> 01:41:59,630
the moon that are not natural I don't

2178
01:42:04,720 --> 01:42:01,550
know what happened to those photos I

2179
01:42:05,440 --> 01:42:04,730
don't remember which ones I had made me

2180
01:42:07,630 --> 01:42:05,450
before I died

2181
01:42:10,210 --> 01:42:07,640
there's a box I haven't opened I'll find

2182
01:42:12,910 --> 01:42:10,220
them I've seen teasing references to

2183
01:42:15,880 --> 01:42:12,920
them over the years David Childress

2184
01:42:17,760 --> 01:42:15,890
snatcher after Childress has a book out

2185
01:42:20,920 --> 01:42:17,770
for years now called

2186
01:42:23,980 --> 01:42:20,930
ancient archaeology it doesn't have

2187
01:42:25,810 --> 01:42:23,990
copies of the photos but it has copies

2188
01:42:29,350 --> 01:42:25,820
of the handful of what seemed to be

2189
01:42:31,960 --> 01:42:29,360
second and third generation copies so

2190
01:42:34,720 --> 01:42:31,970
the grain is breaking down a bit but

2191
01:42:38,830 --> 01:42:34,730
they're real copies of allegedly real

2192
01:42:40,510 --> 01:42:38,840
photos and I have a few you can find

2193
01:42:41,110 --> 01:42:40,520
them I would suggest to your listeners

2194
01:42:43,240 --> 01:42:41,120
who are in

2195
01:42:47,340 --> 01:42:43,250
to build a file the same way that you

2196
01:42:49,600 --> 01:42:47,350
can download sections of a video of

2197
01:42:52,570 --> 01:42:49,610
anomalies happening photograph from the

2198
01:42:54,550 --> 01:42:52,580
state station just put anomalies in

2199
01:42:58,710 --> 01:42:54,560
space structures on the moon structures

2200
01:43:01,900 --> 01:42:58,720
on Mars one that completely blew my mind

2201
01:43:06,000 --> 01:43:01,910
that not only is not any chance that

2202
01:43:10,530 --> 01:43:06,010
it's natural but reminded me only of

2203
01:43:13,060 --> 01:43:10,540
maybe what a really big multifaceted

2204
01:43:15,940 --> 01:43:13,070
terminal would look like from the air at

2205
01:43:19,530 --> 01:43:15,950
an International Airport I mean really

2206
01:43:23,380 --> 01:43:19,540
off the map then the things on the moon

2207
01:43:25,810 --> 01:43:23,390
often clearer often more provocative

2208
01:43:28,240 --> 01:43:25,820
there are craters all over the moon of

2209
01:43:30,700 --> 01:43:28,250
course everyone's away come on a crater

2210
01:43:33,010 --> 01:43:30,710
that's so perfect that you have to

2211
01:43:35,320 --> 01:43:33,020
wonder or something that if you look at

2212
01:43:38,620 --> 01:43:35,330
it you see and we're looking now at an

2213
01:43:41,560 --> 01:43:38,630
amazing thing which is actually a dome

2214
01:43:43,270 --> 01:43:41,570
on the surface of the Moon and it's got

2215
01:43:46,930 --> 01:43:43,280
to be huge I don't know how many miles

2216
01:43:50,350 --> 01:43:46,940
across but it is absolutely dead-on

2217
01:43:54,730 --> 01:43:50,360
perfect circle it is not a crater

2218
01:43:58,150 --> 01:43:54,740
it is not concave it is convex and it

2219
01:44:02,230 --> 01:43:58,160
seems to it's it's too perfect yeah it's

2220
01:44:06,490 --> 01:44:02,240
too perfect it's not natural one of my

2221
01:44:08,800 --> 01:44:06,500
favorite moon anomalies is a crater that

2222
01:44:12,100 --> 01:44:08,810
is so perfect that it's hard to believe

2223
01:44:15,130 --> 01:44:12,110
that it is natural but it may be who am

2224
01:44:17,200 --> 01:44:15,140
I to say however it has a shape next to

2225
01:44:20,500 --> 01:44:17,210
it it's almost half a crater but it's

2226
01:44:23,170 --> 01:44:20,510
not quite round the thing is there is an

2227
01:44:26,440 --> 01:44:23,180
area in shadow that would be you know

2228
01:44:29,860 --> 01:44:26,450
convex but the shadow is created by a

2229
01:44:34,060 --> 01:44:29,870
dead-on straight line that runs over 20

2230
01:44:37,000 --> 01:44:34,070
miles and that is impossible to have

2231
01:44:40,870 --> 01:44:37,010
formed in nature from everything we

2232
01:44:43,060 --> 01:44:40,880
understand and know about the history of

2233
01:44:47,230 --> 01:44:43,070
how the surface of the Moon formed and

2234
01:44:51,940 --> 01:44:47,240
we're stuck with this now if and then

2235
01:44:53,740 --> 01:44:51,950
Snowden or Julian Assange got a bee in

2236
01:44:54,000 --> 01:44:53,750
their bonnet about this stuff and you

2237
01:44:57,359 --> 01:44:54,010
know

2238
01:45:00,540 --> 01:44:57,369
given a pile of it if they broke it it

2239
01:45:02,370 --> 01:45:00,550
might go viral and major median

2240
01:45:05,879 --> 01:45:02,380
governments might have to respond as

2241
01:45:08,490 --> 01:45:05,889
well as the astronomical community as

2242
01:45:11,700 --> 01:45:08,500
far as I'm concerned the astronomers of

2243
01:45:15,060 --> 01:45:11,710
the world who along with other people in

2244
01:45:17,910 --> 01:45:15,070
science politicians and mental health

2245
01:45:20,669 --> 01:45:17,920
professionals seem to be the most

2246
01:45:22,890 --> 01:45:20,679
sensitive people relative to being

2247
01:45:25,770 --> 01:45:22,900
associated with flying saucers and

2248
01:45:27,720 --> 01:45:25,780
little green men which is just you know

2249
01:45:31,080 --> 01:45:27,730
it's you're crazy if you believe in this

2250
01:45:32,580 --> 01:45:31,090
stuff and I'm a busy person even if

2251
01:45:34,830 --> 01:45:32,590
somebody I know and like and respect

2252
01:45:36,990 --> 01:45:34,840
thinks there's something to it I only

2253
01:45:38,970 --> 01:45:37,000
have so much time I am NOT going to be

2254
01:45:41,220 --> 01:45:38,980
bothered reading any of these books god

2255
01:45:42,899 --> 01:45:41,230
knows if I was caught reading one the

2256
01:45:45,120 --> 01:45:42,909
impact on my career would be terrible

2257
01:45:47,700 --> 01:45:45,130
and surely there's something better to

2258
01:45:49,979 --> 01:45:47,710
do anyway in my heart of hearts if it is

2259
01:45:52,080 --> 01:45:49,989
true I don't even really want to know it

2260
01:45:53,640 --> 01:45:52,090
because that means everything that I

2261
01:45:54,270 --> 01:45:53,650
thought is true might be open to

2262
01:45:56,879 --> 01:45:54,280
question

2263
01:45:59,609 --> 01:45:56,889
this is radical but one thing we can say

2264
01:46:01,890 --> 01:45:59,619
for sure is that astronomers are looking

2265
01:46:03,600 --> 01:46:01,900
in the wrong place or if they're seeing

2266
01:46:06,779 --> 01:46:03,610
some movement in space they're not

2267
01:46:09,870 --> 01:46:06,789
letting us know yeah so I am going to

2268
01:46:11,879 --> 01:46:09,880
continue to refine this talk but I was

2269
01:46:14,580 --> 01:46:11,889
so glad that you were interested in it

2270
01:46:17,189 --> 01:46:14,590
for the show because it's so germane at

2271
01:46:19,700 --> 01:46:17,199
this moment for me again it's exciting

2272
01:46:22,259 --> 01:46:19,710
period for me I've got some great

2273
01:46:26,729 --> 01:46:22,269
situations coming up and presentations

2274
01:46:28,859 --> 01:46:26,739
and research projects but this again is

2275
01:46:33,299 --> 01:46:28,869
kind of a pet project it's brand-new I'd

2276
01:46:38,689 --> 01:46:33,309
like to have it worked out and in my bag

2277
01:46:42,330 --> 01:46:38,699
so to say that I could tailor it to any

2278
01:46:44,549 --> 01:46:42,340
non UFO audience whether it was a high

2279
01:46:47,490 --> 01:46:44,559
school group or a technical group

2280
01:46:52,109 --> 01:46:47,500
whether it was you know as a fundraiser

2281
01:46:55,589 --> 01:46:52,119
for a fraternal organization or a talk

2282
01:46:58,200 --> 01:46:55,599
at a conference that was not a UFO

2283
01:47:00,569 --> 01:46:58,210
oriented but that they wanted a speaker

2284
01:47:03,450 --> 01:47:00,579
on the subject to speak to their

2285
01:47:06,570 --> 01:47:03,460
audience that was not informed and give

2286
01:47:09,780 --> 01:47:06,580
them a sweep across so again it's

2287
01:47:10,920 --> 01:47:09,790
work in progress but I'm glad that I

2288
01:47:13,370 --> 01:47:10,930
could share it with you and your

2289
01:47:17,370 --> 01:47:13,380
listeners tonight it's it's a

2290
01:47:20,250 --> 01:47:17,380
fascinating talk and presentation I mean

2291
01:47:22,860 --> 01:47:20,260
like you said it spreads across so many

2292
01:47:26,370 --> 01:47:22,870
different facets I mean our history

2293
01:47:28,800 --> 01:47:26,380
comes to mind and how these images have

2294
01:47:30,540 --> 01:47:28,810
been overlooked you know by art

2295
01:47:33,090 --> 01:47:30,550
historians throughout and you have to

2296
01:47:34,770 --> 01:47:33,100
wonder again that ridiculous oh we're

2297
01:47:36,090 --> 01:47:34,780
going to ignore that why would I want to

2298
01:47:38,610 --> 01:47:36,100
bring this to the attention of the head

2299
01:47:42,350 --> 01:47:38,620
of my department I the talk I'll be

2300
01:47:46,470 --> 01:47:42,360
giving two talks in Roswell New Mexico

2301
01:47:49,710 --> 01:47:46,480
that will be the main one because Roz

2302
01:47:52,890 --> 01:47:49,720
will the events of late June or early

2303
01:47:55,290 --> 01:47:52,900
July were so integral to creating the

2304
01:47:57,930 --> 01:47:55,300
backlash of not taking the subject

2305
01:47:59,730 --> 01:47:57,940
serious immediately the other talk I'm

2306
01:48:02,070 --> 01:47:59,740
giving is on a pet subject that I've

2307
01:48:04,080 --> 01:48:02,080
kicked around for years many of our

2308
01:48:06,810 --> 01:48:04,090
colleagues feel and understandably

2309
01:48:09,090 --> 01:48:06,820
that there is a program called

2310
01:48:12,240 --> 01:48:09,100
disclosure that has been going on for

2311
01:48:14,400 --> 01:48:12,250
decades that it's a slow process of

2312
01:48:16,340 --> 01:48:14,410
enculturation the people of Earth with

2313
01:48:20,100 --> 01:48:16,350
popular culture popular imagery

2314
01:48:22,890 --> 01:48:20,110
Hollywood movies advertisements news

2315
01:48:25,470 --> 01:48:22,900
stories to get them ready over the

2316
01:48:27,630 --> 01:48:25,480
course of 50 or 60 years for you know

2317
01:48:30,900 --> 01:48:27,640
the other shoe to drop whatever and that

2318
01:48:33,570 --> 01:48:30,910
as part of it there is a wonderful idea

2319
01:48:38,760 --> 01:48:33,580
that the world of advertising wherever

2320
01:48:42,300 --> 01:48:38,770
you see an ad that uses actual images of

2321
01:48:44,640 --> 01:48:42,310
UFOs flying saucers aliens in an an

2322
01:48:47,580 --> 01:48:44,650
whether it's to sell ice cream to kids

2323
01:48:49,740 --> 01:48:47,590
or computers to adults whether it's

2324
01:48:52,980 --> 01:48:49,750
based on a total confabulation and a

2325
01:48:55,290 --> 01:48:52,990
charming little silly image or that it

2326
01:48:57,390 --> 01:48:55,300
refers directly to back-engineering or

2327
01:48:59,280 --> 01:48:57,400
abduction which some of them do that

2328
01:49:02,130 --> 01:48:59,290
they're it's part of the master plan and

2329
01:49:04,620 --> 01:49:02,140
that movers and shakers whose names we

2330
01:49:07,830 --> 01:49:04,630
never know interact with leaders of the

2331
01:49:10,950 --> 01:49:07,840
advertising industry blah blah blah so I

2332
01:49:13,170 --> 01:49:10,960
I gave that a lot of thought and where

2333
01:49:15,900 --> 01:49:13,180
it sprang from was over the years you

2334
01:49:17,550 --> 01:49:15,910
may have a similar file many people in

2335
01:49:18,710 --> 01:49:17,560
the work you know you develop files that

2336
01:49:22,850 --> 01:49:18,720
go off on tangents

2337
01:49:26,270 --> 01:49:22,860
of any aspect and anytime I saw an ad

2338
01:49:27,770 --> 01:49:26,280
that had some UFO image in it I pulled

2339
01:49:29,420 --> 01:49:27,780
it out of the magazine or newspaper and

2340
01:49:31,550 --> 01:49:29,430
put it in a file and at a certain point

2341
01:49:33,830 --> 01:49:31,560
I thought I wonder if there is anything

2342
01:49:35,660 --> 01:49:33,840
to this idea and would it make an

2343
01:49:38,570 --> 01:49:35,670
interesting talk at that point I began

2344
01:49:40,610 --> 01:49:38,580
to solicit colleagues and got images

2345
01:49:43,040 --> 01:49:40,620
from different countries then I broke

2346
01:49:45,200 --> 01:49:43,050
them down into topic headings of the

2347
01:49:46,940 --> 01:49:45,210
audience that they were aimed at what

2348
01:49:49,400 --> 01:49:46,950
the unifying subject was you'd be

2349
01:49:52,010 --> 01:49:49,410
surprised how many insurance companies

2350
01:49:56,390 --> 01:49:52,020
in America and Great Britain South

2351
01:49:58,870 --> 01:49:56,400
America have used an image of a UFO in

2352
01:50:02,870 --> 01:49:58,880
the sky lifting a vehicle off the ground

2353
01:50:05,300 --> 01:50:02,880
to sell insurance it's quite

2354
01:50:07,000 --> 01:50:05,310
extraordinary yeah on computer companies

2355
01:50:12,530 --> 01:50:07,010
and high-tech companies alluding to that

2356
01:50:14,270 --> 01:50:12,540
engineering etc etc and the second talk

2357
01:50:17,660 --> 01:50:14,280
that I'll be doing in Roswell will be

2358
01:50:20,930 --> 01:50:17,670
advertising imagery alien and UFOs and

2359
01:50:25,550 --> 01:50:20,940
advertising and whether or not it is

2360
01:50:29,660 --> 01:50:25,560
part of a grand plan or purely based on

2361
01:50:31,820 --> 01:50:29,670
the reality that pictures of beings from

2362
01:50:34,250 --> 01:50:31,830
other planets and machines from other

2363
01:50:35,330 --> 01:50:34,260
planets sell products yeah and I'm not

2364
01:50:38,330 --> 01:50:35,340
going to tell you what I think the

2365
01:50:41,300 --> 01:50:38,340
answer is mm-hmm have to come to the

2366
01:50:43,760 --> 01:50:41,310
talk to find out well I mean speaking

2367
01:50:46,520 --> 01:50:43,770
about you have Roswell I know you're

2368
01:50:49,880 --> 01:50:46,530
going to be going to Athens again is

2369
01:50:51,620 --> 01:50:49,890
that correct yeah last year myself and

2370
01:50:54,200 --> 01:50:51,630
our dear friend and colleague Richard

2371
01:50:56,990 --> 01:50:54,210
Golan were invited to speak at a

2372
01:50:59,180 --> 01:50:57,000
conference that I had something to do

2373
01:51:01,550 --> 01:50:59,190
with the organization of and a very

2374
01:51:04,610 --> 01:51:01,560
unusual theme in the world of UFO

2375
01:51:07,370 --> 01:51:04,620
studies dr. wilhelm reich somebody whose

2376
01:51:09,320 --> 01:51:07,380
work had been involved in a lot longer

2377
01:51:11,470 --> 01:51:09,330
than I've been involved in UFO studies

2378
01:51:14,570 --> 01:51:11,480
and since I was a teenager in fact

2379
01:51:18,220 --> 01:51:14,580
observed UFOs in the last years of his

2380
01:51:20,750 --> 01:51:18,230
life and published around it and that

2381
01:51:23,540 --> 01:51:20,760
publication public's around it in the

2382
01:51:26,360 --> 01:51:23,550
1950s and having the courage to stand by

2383
01:51:28,100 --> 01:51:26,370
your observations and conclusions was

2384
01:51:29,600 --> 01:51:28,110
one of the kiss of death for his

2385
01:51:31,580 --> 01:51:29,610
international scientific reputation

2386
01:51:32,370 --> 01:51:31,590
which was already under attack for all

2387
01:51:36,080 --> 01:51:32,380
the wrong reasons

2388
01:51:38,610 --> 01:51:36,090
and this conference is rooted in Reich's

2389
01:51:40,980 --> 01:51:38,620
observations about UFOs nobody had ever

2390
01:51:42,810 --> 01:51:40,990
done a conference like it before it's

2391
01:51:45,840 --> 01:51:42,820
called the contact with space conference

2392
01:51:48,380 --> 01:51:45,850
and it is a two-day conference in Athens

2393
01:51:51,900 --> 01:51:48,390
I think on the 17th and 18th of June if

2394
01:51:54,060 --> 01:51:51,910
anybody is interested in going they

2395
01:51:55,830 --> 01:51:54,070
should contact me directly because not

2396
01:51:58,170 --> 01:51:55,840
only will I give them all the details

2397
01:52:00,000 --> 01:51:58,180
but if it's possible if you're going to

2398
01:52:02,610 --> 01:52:00,010
come from the States or Europe Richard

2399
01:52:04,950 --> 01:52:02,620
and I will will stay around after it's a

2400
01:52:08,280 --> 01:52:04,960
peer review conference we're trading a

2401
01:52:09,900 --> 01:52:08,290
salary for a small holiday and looking

2402
01:52:12,330 --> 01:52:09,910
forward to it it's a wonderful country

2403
01:52:16,080 --> 01:52:12,340
with an awful lot of historic problems

2404
01:52:18,810 --> 01:52:16,090
but I'll actually be staying there right

2405
01:52:22,470 --> 01:52:18,820
through the period until it's time to

2406
01:52:25,980 --> 01:52:22,480
fly to New Mexico Richard and he's

2407
01:52:27,300 --> 01:52:25,990
wonderful fan say Tracy we'll be going

2408
01:52:29,610 --> 01:52:27,310
back home for a couple days and then

2409
01:52:31,920 --> 01:52:29,620
we'll meet up in New Mexico after well

2410
01:52:34,410 --> 01:52:31,930
Peter I can't thank you enough this has

2411
01:52:36,150 --> 01:52:34,420
been a fascinating conversation I'm so

2412
01:52:37,620 --> 01:52:36,160
happy we were able to do it in person I

2413
01:52:39,060 --> 01:52:37,630
think it makes all the difference in the

2414
01:52:40,770 --> 01:52:39,070
world and we're going to have to have

2415
01:52:43,200 --> 01:52:40,780
you come back on next time you're in the

2416
01:52:45,030 --> 01:52:43,210
city to tell us about the next salon

2417
01:52:47,430 --> 01:52:45,040
that's going to be going on absolutely

2418
01:52:50,970 --> 01:52:47,440
and of course I'll keep you posted and

2419
01:52:54,000 --> 01:52:50,980
your listeners posted by listing the

2420
01:52:55,860 --> 01:52:54,010
particulars and where to RSVP too when

2421
01:52:57,840 --> 01:52:55,870
we do have a plan like the summer or

2422
01:52:59,580 --> 01:52:57,850
later this summer on your page as well

2423
01:53:01,800 --> 01:52:59,590
as mine and other pages that might be

2424
01:53:04,530 --> 01:53:01,810
interested absolutely please look Peter

2425
01:53:07,050 --> 01:53:04,540
up on Facebook he's very very open to

2426
01:53:09,180 --> 01:53:07,060
that very personable and my hero and

2427
01:53:10,770 --> 01:53:09,190
mentor in this field so again it was a

2428
01:53:13,470 --> 01:53:10,780
true honor having you here Peter

2429
01:53:15,630 --> 01:53:13,480
my pleasure all right guys that is it

2430
01:53:17,970 --> 01:53:15,640
for this week's episode thanks again to

2431
01:53:19,920 --> 01:53:17,980
Peter for coming on for coming all the

2432
01:53:22,350 --> 01:53:19,930
way to Queens to talk to me it was an

2433
01:53:24,810 --> 01:53:22,360
immense pleasure hope everyone enjoyed

2434
01:53:27,030 --> 01:53:24,820
that now for next week guys I am

2435
01:53:29,040 --> 01:53:27,040
actually going to be in Liverpool Nova

2436
01:53:32,250 --> 01:53:29,050
Scotia giving a talk at the East Coast

2437
01:53:34,320 --> 01:53:32,260
Paracon so I'm not quite sure what the

2438
01:53:36,780 --> 01:53:34,330
internet access is going to be like out

2439
01:53:40,440 --> 01:53:36,790
there and if I'm going to be able to

2440
01:53:41,839 --> 01:53:40,450
release on time so I will keep you

2441
01:53:43,370 --> 01:53:41,849
posted on that

2442
01:53:45,050 --> 01:53:43,380
the episode might be coming out earlier

2443
01:53:48,530 --> 01:53:45,060
next week or it might be coming up later

2444
01:53:50,899 --> 01:53:48,540
depending on how remote this area

2445
01:53:52,700 --> 01:53:50,909
actually is I have a feeling everything

2446
01:53:54,859 --> 01:53:52,710
will be okay but either way I'm going to

2447
01:53:57,830 --> 01:53:54,869
be there with a few friends at the show

2448
01:53:58,910 --> 01:53:57,840
Greg Bishop Paul Kimball Micah Hanks

2449
01:54:01,609 --> 01:53:58,920
couple other people

2450
01:54:04,069 --> 01:54:01,619
Tim banal so it's going to be a blast I

2451
01:54:05,660 --> 01:54:04,079
am sure we will sit down and record some

2452
01:54:07,879 --> 01:54:05,670
stuff so I'll be able to share that with

2453
01:54:10,339 --> 01:54:07,889
you other than that guys you can always

2454
01:54:12,439 --> 01:54:10,349
find all past episodes at somewhere in

2455
01:54:14,839 --> 01:54:12,449
the skies calm on iTunes stitcher or

2456
01:54:16,970 --> 01:54:14,849
Google Play youtube please rate and

2457
01:54:20,839 --> 01:54:16,980
review the show wherever applicable it

2458
01:54:23,990 --> 01:54:20,849
really helps us gain new listeners or on

2459
01:54:26,290 --> 01:54:24,000
Twitter at somewhere skies and if you

2460
01:54:28,850 --> 01:54:26,300
want to email me with any questions

2461
01:54:30,709 --> 01:54:28,860
concerns guest suggestions or you want

2462
01:54:34,550 --> 01:54:30,719
to tell your own UFO story you can reach

2463
01:54:36,560 --> 01:54:34,560
me at Sprague 5-1 at hotmail.com yes

2464
01:54:38,510 --> 01:54:36,570
that is hotmail we're having issues with

2465
01:54:40,250 --> 01:54:38,520
the somewhere in the skies email so

2466
01:54:42,169 --> 01:54:40,260
please hit me up you can always contact

2467
01:54:44,839 --> 01:54:42,179
me on the website as well that is it

2468
01:54:45,830 --> 01:54:44,849
guys I hope to see you next Monday again

2469
01:54:48,020 --> 01:54:45,840
I'll keep you posted

2470
01:54:53,100 --> 01:54:48,030
other than that remember keep your feet

2471
01:54:53,110 --> 01:55:04,669
[Music]